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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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You folks are certainly more accomplished musicians than I, but I'm continuously learning from you. I've noticed several forum discussions relating to shots, holds and pushes. I've done some Google searches but can't seem to find a workable definition of what these are, can you help define these terms for me please?
Thanks,
Jeff
Win11, Intel i7 7700K 4.2Ghz, 32Gb RAM, 2x1Tb HD, 500Gb NVMe, BIAB/RB 2024, MOTU 828MK3 audio, MOTU Midi Express, Yamaha Montage 7, DX7II, TX802, Motif XS Rack, Roland Fantom XR Rack, Oberheim Matrix 1000, VoiceLive3 Extreme, Kontakt 6, SampleTank 4.3
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Hi, Jeff - In the context of BIAB, maybe this will help: Push: A push is used to play in anticipation of, or a little ahead of the beat. In BIAB you can push either a 16th note duration (using ^^ in front of the chord) or an 8th note duration (using ^ in front of the chord). Pushes partly overcome the problem that BIAB only allows chords on quarter not boundaries. So, let's say you need a chord to play on the "and" of beat four, then you can "push" the chord of the following beat one back an 8th note so it will play on the "and" of beat four. Unfortunately, this means that you cannot play a new chord on beat one (because you've already used that slot). You now either need to push the chord for beat two to the "and" of beat one, or wait for beat two for a new chord. As a note, several people have requested on the wishlist the ability to (for lack of a better term) "pull" the chord to play after the beat; don't know if we will ever see it. Shot: Think a drum rim shot here, where you hear the "pop" of the drum and then silence until it comes back in. Now extend that to all the other instruments. So a shot is just all instruments hitting the notes of the chord in unison and then not playing again until the next chord Hold: A hold is similar to a shot, except that instead of silence after hitting the chord, the instruments continue to hold the note until the next chord. Obviously instruments with natural decay will do so, but instruments that can "hold" a note will hold it until the next chord. For example, a piano will hold the note until it's natural decay (which depending on the synth you are using could be a few beats, or longer); however, a sax will continue to play it's note regardless of how long it is until the next chord (since a synth doesn't need to take a breath).  Hope the helped, unless you were looking for some other context.
John Laptop-HP Omen I7 Win11Pro 32GB 2x2TB, 1x4TB SSD Desktop-ASUS-I7 Win10Pro 32GB 2x1.5TB, 2x2TB, 1x4TB SATA BB2024/UMC404HD/Casios/Cakewalk/Reaper/Studio One/MixBus/Notion/Finale/Dorico/Noteworthy/NI/Halion/IK http://www.sus4chord.com
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Hi Jeff,
SHOT
I think the term "shot" is borrowed the drum term "rim shot". With a rim shot, the drummer strikes a drum's rum and produces a short, sharp sound. There are Youtube clips on rim shots that will show what I mean.
PG Music use the term "shot" more generally. The same technique of using a short, staccato sound is applied to any of the standard BIAB tracks.
HOLD
The name actually describes it perfectly. A note or chord is played and then held, without any rhythmical vamping, until the next note or chord.
PUSHES
These are when notes or chords occur before the main beat. This is a form of syncopation. BIAB has two types of pushes. There's the an eighth note push (e.g. ^C - this tells the C chord to play on the eighth note immediately before the chord's indicated beat). The second push is the sixteenth note push (e.g. ^^C - which tells the chord to play 1/16th note before the indicated beat).
Hope this helps,
Noel
MY SONGS...Audiophile BIAB 2024
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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These three terms come from the jazz, popular music, rehearsal pianist and studio session world.
They are merely a shortened set of terms for the Classical terminology, kind of like the sort of abbreviations used for Fake Chords.
Push - Describing Classical terms such as "anticipation" or possibly, "syncopation" (a term whose classical use is not really able to cover all the ways in which the Jazz players found to play around the subdivided beat).
Shot - This one should be self-explanatory, there is also a synonym that is rather widely used, "Hit" - in any case, it describes a single note of short duration played by several or all instruments. To my knowledge there is no single Classical term that covers this one, although you might think the Sforzando derivitives, example being perhaps what happens at the end of each theme in Haydn's Surprise Symphony, that sort of thing. (Some may want to view the Surprise Symphony's Shot as a Shot that is also a Hold, I don't simply because the duration of same is about one beat's length, every time.)
Hold - The Classical term is "Formata" - often referred to as a "Bird's Eye" in the US slang classical terminology (see, Classical musicians also enjoyed creating some of their own shortcuts and slang words as well...), "Birdseye" referring to the way the Formata symbol looks on the music notation page.
When confronted with terminologies that may be new to you, or perhaps different in wording, it is a good idea to work on incorporating your understanding and usage of such terminology, rather than the insistence that everybody do it in the way in which you yourself may know how to call it. Terms like these are, after all, not only synonymous with other terms, they help the practicing musicians to communicate more easily with one another.
One thing I've always loved - and respected - about the Band in a Box program is that music terminology theory and other usage does indeed correspond to what the accepted usages and practices are in the majority of music schools and universities rather than resorting to more commonly used "folk" terminologies and such. Another example is the way in which songs may be laid out in BB, the use of the single Chorus to describe the musical function and not the lyrical function, again often misunderstood by those who have not been exposed to the thing in academic fashion.
Therefore, if a terminology is new to you, it might pay big dividends to figure out what that term means when found inside BiaB, add it to your personal musical arsenal.
After all, you don't have to throw away the terminologies previously learned or used when doing this, quite the contrary, just ADD the new-to-you terminology to your vocabulary and keep on having fun.
--Mac
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Thanks guys, appreciate your help with these. It all makes sense now.
Jeff
Win11, Intel i7 7700K 4.2Ghz, 32Gb RAM, 2x1Tb HD, 500Gb NVMe, BIAB/RB 2024, MOTU 828MK3 audio, MOTU Midi Express, Yamaha Montage 7, DX7II, TX802, Motif XS Rack, Roland Fantom XR Rack, Oberheim Matrix 1000, VoiceLive3 Extreme, Kontakt 6, SampleTank 4.3
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Great explanations above.
If you want to do more research on holds, look it up under the spelling, "fermata".
BIAB 2024 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 6.5 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6; Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Roland Integra-7, Presonus Studio 192, Presonus Faderport 8, Royer 121, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Just one nit picky comment on a drum "rim shot."
A rim shot involves striking both the rim and the skin simultaneously which produces what I would describe as a "crack" instead of a "click" that would occur if the rim alone is hit (and drummers do hit the rim alone to produce that "tick" or "click"...or a "thud" (at varying frequencies depending on which skin is hit) if the skin alone is hit.
(-:
Jim
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Expert
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Here's a Video Demo with 8th push, 16th push, shot, hold and rest. push_hold_shot.wmv push_hold_shot.mp4
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Nice demo there Solidrock...appreciate that.
Win11, Intel i7 7700K 4.2Ghz, 32Gb RAM, 2x1Tb HD, 500Gb NVMe, BIAB/RB 2024, MOTU 828MK3 audio, MOTU Midi Express, Yamaha Montage 7, DX7II, TX802, Motif XS Rack, Roland Fantom XR Rack, Oberheim Matrix 1000, VoiceLive3 Extreme, Kontakt 6, SampleTank 4.3
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