One of the best things about trade shows is the opportunity to interact with your peers.
Jim... I think most of the "peers" are here. Honestly, I do not see much interaction between PG dev team and their dear followers who are generously contributing ideas... Like a kind nurse begging glutton: -Darling, do not eat this horrible junk food, you will live longer... But surely glutton knows better than that.
Sorry, sad thoughts overflowing the tank.
Back to the topic. There is a very nicely written VST it is called Scaler. It is available through Plugin Boutique (demo is there as well). I think it is awesome for chord exploration, voicing, inversions and of course scales. Also you can bind chords to keys and whole load of other very cool stuff. I figured out how to use it in DAW., but not sure if I can use it in BIAB since it is not a stand alone... and not really an "instrument" I tried loading it as one (as instrument) into BIAB (32Bit VST) it did not work. Does anybody know how to make such animal work with BIAB? If it possible at all? I would appreciate feedback on this very much.
Unfortunately I haven't found a way to download any user manual and the installation stuff I found isn't product specific so I'm winging it. I apologize in advance if my comments or questions are not specific enough to help.
Are you using the AAX or VST version? Are you using the full or trial version? How is the trial version limited if you're using the trial version?
VST Version 1.5 includes 4 new internal sounds: Electric Guitar, String Ensemble, Acoustic Guitar and Harmonic Guitar. Have you tried to use any of them?
I noticed Plugin Boutique requires iLok. Do they require the usb fob or can you use the iLok software manager? Do you have everything up-to-date with iLok?
You mentioned you used the trial version in a DAW. What daw and what steps did you take to install and use it in a project?
What steps did you take to use it with Band-in-a-Box? Just to make sure no one gets foot-in-mouth disease is your computer a Mac or PC? What operating system?
Looking at the support section of their website I notice there are several software programs (DAWs) that PlugIn Boutique programs will not communicate with. They suggest a $99 BlueCat midi utility program that can be used as a workaround.
Also. I'll point out you may want to ask the question in a new thread that is dedicated to the question. More eyes may see the question so the question will have a better chance of receiving an appropriate answer.
Finally, have you discussed the issue with PlugIn Boutigue support? They have an online contact service +++ HERE +++
Jim, I have full version. I grabbed it some time ago on their flash sale. But before that, I tried it as a demo. It did not require ilok. In DAW I am using 64bit VST, but for BIAB I installed 32Bit VST, which I can not get to work. VST simply does not start/load..
Since we talked about "chord builder" and inputting the chords into BIAB I thought I would continue with this thread as it is related... Just does not feel right to consider spending $100 for bluecatmidi program. I do not need full power features of the wonderful Scaler in BIAB. I just want to use it as a reference for finding right chords for the job. I do not need complex routing to transfer the chords to bars... as Bob mentioned (if I understood correctly) chord structure is not a part of MIDI protocol. So I will write them manually to bars.
I think I know how workaround can be achieved... by using some sort of standalone VST host and use internal sounds of Scaler as reference, keeping both programs (BIAB and VST host+ Scaler) open. I was hoping it can be "plugged" directly into BIAB...
P.S. I think the Scaler surpasses "chord builder" in many (MANY!) ways, except of course, for entering chords directly to bars. Just an opinion.
So, here is the chord entry tool for BIAB. A sub-menu shows all related chords, and it is even kind enough to show the intervals and notes. It's like a music class, and better than 100 theory books or chord chart books that you would have to flip through.
Extremely efficient. All you need.
You sit down to write a song. You audition chords, beat by beat, or measure by measure, even new ones you have never heard of. No that does not work. Let me try another one. Hey that is cool! I think I have a progression going. But hey, how do I play that chord on the guitar? I see, you are giving me the notes BIAB. Thanks! Got it! Sure am glad I learned the notes on my instrument before I tried to play it!
Now here I go: Intro, V, Chorus chords done. Super.
Go to song form dialog. Select style, song form, click, render print.
If you are a songwriter, what else on God's green earth could you possibly be looking for?
I absolutely do not understand what people are asking for that "isn't here" and is "too complicated"--and why--if writing a song is your goal.
Really.
Not trying to be sarcastic.
I just don't get it. It's all right there.
And it's so easy.
David Snyder Songwriter/Renaissance Man Studio + Fingers
David, thanks for taking the time, but I know how it is done in BIAB.
When you say: "I just don't don't get it. It's all right there." All it tells me you have not tried anything better. It is like if you went to the same gas station that serves pizza year after year, you would develop a "taste" for that specific pizza. Does it have all the nutrients of most of other pizzas? Sure it does! Will it fill you up? Sure it will! But is it a good pizza??? Can you compare it to a good Italian pizza place pie? Well, you can say that they both round (or square), have tomato sauce and cheese on the top and you are really confused why some people would want something different... And to some your argument is valid.
P.S. If you have some time look into Scaler VST. Demo is free. Maybe then you will see, what BIAB is missing
When you say: "I just don't don't get it. It's all right there." All it tells me you have not tried anything better.
Sure I have. I have used plenty of other tools. Among them: my brain. Yes, I have used my own brain, plugged in my guitar or turned on my keyboard and played.
Bottom line though: It is just that reading some of the complaints about what people want and can't find, it seems they have not actually looked at what the program does. That simple. It is all I am trying to say.
As for Scaler, I looked at it. I guess it is cool and I will check it out if I have time, but ultimately I don't get the point all that much.
In my opinion there is no magical program or gadget anywhere that is going to make you a better musician or producer, really, though I am a huge fan of Real Tracks, because they are special, being, well real tracks.
As for the rest of it, the smallest amount of musical theory, ingenuity and craftsmanship will get you a long way, if you know how to write a good song, and manipulate audio or midi through the five billion libraries currently available. And if you know how to mix.
So I guess I wish you the best of luck in your journey to find what you are looking for, in terms of tools and software, and I sincerely mean that, I really do. And I hope it helps you produce good music you can share with us so we can share in your sense of accomplishment.
I like to see people happily producing music, and so far, BIAB has given me everything I need that I don't produce with my own fingers.
Best of luck.
David Snyder Songwriter/Renaissance Man Studio + Fingers
"I think the Scaler surpasses "chord builder" in many (MANY!) ways, except of course, for entering chords directly to bars." AND "for BIAB I installed 32Bit VST, which I can not get to work. VST simply does not start/load."
I find that to be kind of a 'deal breaker' since you can accomplish the task in the BIAB "chord builder" quicker than you can say VST three times in a row. In your particular case it doesn't matter if it has better features in one way or a thousand if it doesn't work.
Charlie, Scaler is a wonderfully written piece of software and something is telling me that you have not tried it, so I feel you are arguing blindly.
For me music is more about "being creative" rather than as you said: "accomplish the task"
And just as you said it, chord builder of BIAB is about "accomplish the task"... were Scaler is a tool focused more on creativity, learning process, ease of use, exploration, fast, elegant, etc. I found an awkward but working way to have both programs open, so lucky me.
You're right. Not only have I not tried it, I'd never heard of it before this thread. Saying that, it's not likely to be in my creative future. I'm glad it works for you, awkward as it may be. I look forward to hearing some of your music one day here on the forum or even on the radio. I wish you the best either way.
Charlie, there is always Google, Youtube and wast resources of internet available at your finger tips to gather some useful knowledge, other than from this forum. Works well for me.
By the way, somebody talked about Scaler on this forum. Thread was several month young so I did not want to revive it.
Oh my, I seemed to have underwhelmed you with my skills and resources knowledge. But just to ease your mind;
Liam Neeson from the movie 'Taken' 2008: " I can tell you I don't have money, but what I do have are a very particular set of skills. Skills I have acquired over a very long career.... "
Walter Brennan from Guns of 'Will Sonnett' 1967: "No brag -- Just fact"
Charlie, I did not ask for your list of achievements, honestly I care less. This was about you arguing of something that you have no clue about. That's all.
I have followed this long and tortured thread now for 7 pages. I now find myself wondering about the OP s original intentions .
What started of as a few simple questions from a newbie that were soon answered on the first page , it seems to have developed into a long string of loosely related topics That in The end members agree to disagree on, On the way some quite strong opinions being expressed, and quite a few argumentative and unkind post as well. Not up to this forums normal good conduct .
For me to even feel the need to say this surely shows things are not quite right here. But I just cant get my head around what its all about.
Please don’t say I don’t have to read it, I have learned a lot from reading post on this forum and normally enjoy the experience. Some what perplexed Wooden spoon Mike Head.
I agree completely Mike Head. I had decided to drop from this thread with my last comment and only post now to stress my last post was in jest and not anger or rebuttal. I'm not sure why my ambivalence toward Scaler turned the conversation somewhat personal but the fact it did left me perplexed, not offended.
I find it a bit obscure when grown up people argue about something that they have never seen or tried before.
Most of nonsense of this post relates to initial question #5:
"Is there a good reason why chords can not be entered straight from midi controller, is there a way to bypass "CTRl+Enter" when entering them from controller"
It was answered in depth. However, when I brought Scaler VST to attention, arguing that it is far more advanced and user friendly tool to explore progressions, etc. than "chord builder" of BIAB, post was met with something completely different than "support", "interest" or even "weighted opinion" by couple of veteran members.
How can you judge of experience that you never had? Beats me.
I re-read this thread, trying not to be swayed by the snark, and concentrating on the content.
While Scaler doesn't offer me anything in particular, I viewed the three videos that come up about it in a minimal Google search. Here's the one I think might give anyone the best idea of what it is:
I do agree that some aspects of Scaler's chord entry are useful but I'm not yet sure how they apply to BIAB. John Ford gave the answer about the MIDI Chord Detection feature of BIAB that I would have given, namely that there are four choices offered and since I compose jazz I wouldn't want any of these to be chosen automatically. Since I know music theory, sometimes I don't accept any of the four. Nevertheless, I think the MIDI Chord Detection in BIAB is one of its best and most powerful features, as well as the most underrated.
BIAB 2025 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 7 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6, Song Master Pro, Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Roland Integra-7, Presonus 192 & Faderport 8, Royer 121, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors.
I too want to keep the tone positive. I looked at other products and they all have great merit in their own right.
But I then questioned if BiaB wants to or should have the capabilities to also integrate all of these other quality products.
After all, it's purpose is to be a music accompaniment program. I don't think its primary intention is to teach music theory, or to tutor music rudiments, or to advise what chords are best used in any particular circumstance. There are many other products that can do this now that users can take advantage of separately.
BiaB is already extremely comprehensive in its own right (maybe too comprehensive?) and it supplies a unique market placement.
Fresh ideas are always worthy of consideration, but in reality no 'one product' can ever be 'all products'. Horses for Courses .
BIAB & RB2025 Win.(Audiophile), Sonar Platinum, Cakewalk by Bandlab, Izotope Prod.Bundle, Roland RD-1000, Synthogy Ivory, Kontakt, Focusrite 18i20, KetronSD2, NS40M Monitors, Pioneer Active Monitors, AKG K271 Studio H'phones
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