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Songwriting
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We're good. Just taking a silly look at other ways of incomes from music.
I will share with you that the stories are real for the most part. I know someone who really got a corporate funded gig in break room chat. I've personally been doing sound for our local school since the 1980's. Since 1992 I've been the full time sound man for my local churches I've attended at one then the other. I do Behringer X32 training and programming for two local churches and consult with two other churches on as needed basis. I make backing tracks for three churches as needed.
I know the person that got a full time gig by approaching a gospel group that needed help with their sound. I was the sound engineer for an Eagles Tribute Band for several years and still program their X32 for each seasons new tour setup or if they have a change in personnel. I also consult and program for them on an as-needed basis.
<<< Now to be clear, those opportunities are far and few between. Mainly because society has mostly moved beyond horse-drawn buggies! >>>
The good news here is you're only correct about horse drawn buggies. The opportunities are near and many. If you live anywhere near a metro area, there will literally be dozens of churches, civic organizations, small and large public and private businesses, Possibly national corporations, hotel chains that accommodate conferences and conventions as well a schools that utilize PA systems big and small.
You would likely be amazed at the opportunities that will seek you out once your name is out there.
Happy gigging. I'm out of here. Got to program the X32 for the tribute band tonight.
BIAB 2025:RB 2025, Latest builds: Dell Optiplex 7040 Desktop; Windows-10-64 bit, Intel Core i7-6700 3.4GHz CPU and 16 GB Ram Memory.
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I am with Charlie on this one. I personally do make quite a bit out of my music by simply doing more of what works and less of what doesn’t. Granted it is not a living but it is growing all the time. The money I make comes from: 1. My course 2. Doing things for others on Fiverr (tuning vocals, singing jingles, making play along videos) 3. My Youtube channel (specifically my play-along videos) I have made almost $0 (or even less than $0 in some cases) out of some of the things I have tried such as: 1. Music licensing 2. Performing (including at our National Arts Festival) 3. Recording and Releasing music (both covers and originals) on digital platforms. 4. Facebook 5. Periscope 6. Twitter 7. Writing and recording original songs In the in-between category, I have made some money out of the following (but these do take quite a bit of effort) 1. Performing for tips on Streetjelly 2. Recording and selling CDs at my live shows 3. Doing private gigs In short, I try to be of service to others and devote my energies 100% to what life puts in-front of me. I do still intend to carry on doing some of the things in the second and third category because I love it..... Who knows what may lie around the corner. 
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Very nicely described Joanne, thanks!
 Steve BIAB/RB 2022, Pro Tools 2020, Korg N5, JBL LSR 4328 Powered Monitors, AKG/Shure Mics.
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Yeah Joanne, this is great.
While I am not making a fortune by any means, I am just pleasantly surprised that complete strangers are buying entire albums I have put out, recorded at home.
By far some of the most fun I have had in a long time is just interacting with happy people on the forum, doing some collabs, making new friends. I have made some GREAT friends on this forum.
But as you have implied, it is all just so much FUN--in what otherwise could be a rather dreary and disturbing world.
Making music just makes me happy, it is as simple as that. I don't care if I never make "real money"--whatever that is. Real money has different definitions for everyone.
But you can't buy happy--and that's what music gives me so I'm sticking with that, hobby or not, it's what I love.
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I don't mean this to be rude but the reason most performing artist don't make much money is because they lack the skill to compete.
Just ask yourself these type questions.
1. Have I spent seven to ten thousand hours studying my instrument?
2. Can I sing as well as Whitney Houston or Freddy Mercury?
3. Can I play my instrument better than my idol?
4. Do I have the business skills to run my music business or any business?
5. Do I have the sort of image the public will pay for?
6. Can I manage to not die of drug addiction if I am successful?
7. Have I ever decided how much money I wanted to make?
8. What action have I taken in the last day or two toward any of this?
I know bands who do not have all of the above skills. A few I know work really hard and play 200 to 250 nights a year. Depending on where they live they are making $20,000 to $50,000 per year. Most have day jobs and many are music related.
Other music industry jobs. Film Scoring. $40,000 to $50,000 a year. The days of making 20 to 30K a week are long gone and will never return. Netflex is spending huge amounts of money so there are a few more jobs around. There are a few people who have made millions and still do.
Now...lets go to the bottom of the barrel. I can take my acoustic guitar and walk around any city and make enough money to buy something to eat and sleep under a bridge. So...you think that is really bad? Would you rather spend the night in Syria? How about Mozambique? Anyone been worried about being eaten by a lion lately? Had to watch your kid die of starvation lately?
The point is that how much money you make is relative. Chances are if you live in the United States and make $300,000 next year you will complain that it is not enough.
Cheers,
Billy
“Amazing! I’ll be working with Jaco Pastorius, Charlie Parker, Art Tatum, and Buddy Rich, and you’re telling me it’s not that great of a gig?
“Well…” Saint Peter, hesitated, “God’s got this girlfriend who thinks she can sing…”
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Journeyman
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Lack of skills? I doubt that. The whole popular music industry is more political than Washington. Do some research on how songs are picked for the top 40.
I have a friend who worked for a popular midwest radio station in the middle of the night. For some reason he had a time slot that was not filled with a song. So he chose the B side of a record to fill the silence. It was 3 AM and by 6 AM he was fired.
...Deb
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Deb,
Thanks for this observation. I think you are right in so many ways.
I find the forum to be interesting in how many different sides there are to everything, but any topic can be examined from a hundred angles, I guess.
Since this website is the product of a music software company which allows people to write and produce songs at home, the only arguments that really pique my attention are musical arguments--when someone composes and produces a SONG (instrumental or with vocals) and puts that song out there to say, in effect, "Try this one on for size."
If the song is great, I feel happy, I smile, and I have respect for that person's gumption. As Handel was told by his father, "Son, if you don't like modern church music, go write some church songs of your own."
Bottom line, I like it when people make their musical points with music, at the end of the day.
Five billion words of insight about music will leave almost no impression on me if there is not music to back it up. I get hundreds of spam emails a week from people screaming at the top of their lungs that if I only pay $29.95 a month, they will teach me to get to the top of the golden charts.
Do they have any music or songs to back this up?
Of course not.
I am impressed by musical arguments, though, when a person makes their argument in a song.
That is why I spend most of my time on this website on the showcase.
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Deb,
Thanks for this observation. I think you are right in so many ways.
Bottom line, I like it when people make their musical points with music, at the end of the day.
Do they have any music or songs to back this up?
Of course not.
I am convinced of all musical arguments, though, when a person makes their argument in a song.
Oddly, this subject came up in an article just yesterday. Here's Don McLean's take on music as a career and money. Don McLean finance article Look at his time at his earning peak. Tax rate was 70% and everyone was getting a piece of his 'American Pie' literally. Of a million dollars he earned, he go to net $100.000 at the end of the day. $65,000 went toward purchasing a home. He still owns that home today. His story falls right in line with the thrust of what my brother was trying to teach me years ago. You only have to get it right once and keep the net money you make.
BIAB 2025:RB 2025, Latest builds: Dell Optiplex 7040 Desktop; Windows-10-64 bit, Intel Core i7-6700 3.4GHz CPU and 16 GB Ram Memory.
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Thank you for sharing the Don McLean article. He makes perfect sense about the financial part of his career.
And, I didn't know he had another CD out.
...Deb
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I was one of the lucky ones that could make a living at music, tho it was as a Live Musician for Hire. These days with so few places to play that PAY you decent $$$ I could not see a life as I lead for close to 4 decades.
I will bet that you COULD make a living as a muso / song writer in today's market, but it would be VERY hard work for VERY little moola for a few years.....
i5 3.20GHz, 32gb RAM, 1tb SSD OS, 12tb HDD, 4gb gForce vid card, 32" monitor, Audient id44, Win10 x64, BiaB/RB 2023, Reaper 6,IK Multimedia Total Studio 3.5 MAX, Waves 10
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As an inventor, Edison made 1,000 unsuccessful attempts at inventing the light bulb. Now i wonder if he got his hard working man's well deserved royalties .... or that he ripped off by some Far Eastern Big Industrial Country with no scruples ...
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<<< Now I wonder if he got his hard working man's well deserved royalties ... or that he ripped off by some Far Eastern Big Industrial Country with no scruples …. >>>
According to Celebrity Net worth site and several other sites, Edison's net worth when he died in 1931 was $12 million dollars ($170 Million 2018) so he undoubtedly got his hard working man's well deserved royalties, and other deserved income and recognition as well. 2,332 patents in his lifetime.
The statement of 1,000 unsuccessful attempts before inventing the light bulb is actually inaccurate to me. What he failed at completing was not the idea, theory or achievement of a working light bulb but rather making a commercially viable light bulb product. He constructed hundreds of operating light bulbs they just were not suitable as a final cost and energy efficient consumer product.
He was like so many songwriters; Seeking not to just write a song (of which they write hundreds if not a thousand - sort of like Edison's lightbulb) but to write a super hit... that consumers will by the millions... All of the hundreds or thousand songs were not necessarily failures at being a song, or even good songs, they just were not the commercial success the songwriter was seeking.
EDIT: Well deserved - Everyone knows Edison but no one can name the one's that rip him off.
Last edited by Charlie Fogle; 04/04/19 05:53 AM.
BIAB 2025:RB 2025, Latest builds: Dell Optiplex 7040 Desktop; Windows-10-64 bit, Intel Core i7-6700 3.4GHz CPU and 16 GB Ram Memory.
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Charlie-really great points. Actually though, Edison is credited with saying 10,000. I do see many people say 1000, though. Pretty amazing really either way.
Tesla, has always been my guy though. It's pretty cool to see him starting to get some recognition. I studied both of them at length when I was younger. Amazing people!
Chad (Hope that makes it easier)
TEMPO TANTRUM: What a lead singer has when they can't stay in time.
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Telsa's DC model for long distance electrical household current transmission was superior to Edison's AC model but Edison had the greater political clout to sell his idea. There is a lot of waste and lost energy along AC transmission lines.
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Actually it was Tesla who invented Alternating current.
AC is much more efficient than DC for transmitting electricity over great distances.
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Actually it was Tesla who invented Alternating current.
AC is much more efficient than DC for transmitting electricity over great distances. This is what I thought also. Researching proved this right.
Today I bought a doughnut without the sprinkles. Diets are hard!
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
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You're right. I had it backwards. I should have thought of the Telsa Coil and Westinghouse!
BIAB 2025:RB 2025, Latest builds: Dell Optiplex 7040 Desktop; Windows-10-64 bit, Intel Core i7-6700 3.4GHz CPU and 16 GB Ram Memory.
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Telsa was an Edison employee for some time. During that time Edison filed more than 16 patents based on Telsa's discoveries and inventions. Telsa quit after Edison refused to pay royalties Edison was contractually obligated to pay. The Edison Company merged with another to become General Electric. Telsa was hired by the company that became Westinghouse. Both Edison and Westinghouse bid on the opportunity to provide the lighting for the 1893 Chicago World Fair. Westinghouse won the bid and Telsa was tasked with inventing a light bulb that wouldn't infringe on Edison's patent and have 93,000 built and installed by the time the fair opened. +++ HERE +++ is a Wikipedia article about the fair. Section 8, Electricity, has informative section about the AC/DC battle and the Edison/Telsa feud.
Jim Fogle - 2025 BiaB (1124) RB (1) Ultra+ PAK DAWs: Cakewalk by BandLab (CbB) - Standalone: Zoom MRS-8 Laptop: i3 Win 10, 8GB ram 500GB HDD Desktop: i7 Win 11, 12GB ram 256GB SSD, 4 TB HDD Music at: https://fogle622.wix.com/fogle622-audio-home
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Her goal was to reach one thousand people that will purchase her album of the Micro Niche genre along with some other accessory such as a T-Shirt or Coffee Cup. The Album and souvenir will sell for $25.
Her goal is to sell 1000 of these units over the next year.
1,000 X $25 = $25,000 yearly income.
Did she have production costs, printing the CDs through a service or are they home computer burns? Are there CD sleeves with art work? How much does each mug and shirt cost to produce? The first 2 questions are variables, but home burned CDs vs CDBaby burned with artwork sounds kind of cheesy to me. And those mugs and shorts aren't $0 to her unless she also does ceramics and screen printing. Only point being that it isn't 1000 x $25. Reality is $25 less expenses. So it's likely more like 1000 X $13-$15. Wish her well with her dream though. While it's an old subject to return to, I found it interesting that even Graham Cochran of the Recording Revolution has jumped on the 1000 fan bandwagon and he shares with us the concept has been around since 2008 in his blog - HERE _ . It seems that this subject is discussed beyond our confines here on the forum.
BIAB 2025:RB 2025, Latest builds: Dell Optiplex 7040 Desktop; Windows-10-64 bit, Intel Core i7-6700 3.4GHz CPU and 16 GB Ram Memory.
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