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Janice is now on around 40 Spotify playlists so I occasionally search around the net on her name and sometimes find blog posts, etc., about her that we weren't aware of. Yesterday, and I have no idea how I've missed it, I discovered that her song The Right Track (co-written with floyd jane) has been on an album (last song in photo) and for sale since 2019 by ZDigital. They sell digital downloads in several countries. Hmmmm ... it's not a cover of the song but our actual recording. Then I found that Amazon had a now d/c CD of it for sale ... Hmmmm ... again. After a LOT of pondering I think that it may be a result of our Songtradr licensing but I'm gonna have to do a deep dive into our statements from them that I never read in detail given the charitably stated modest income.  Anyhow, I thought this might be of some interest. Ya never know. Bud EDIT: I've resolved the perceived issue with a little research. In 2018 I added several songs to Songtradr’s "monetization option." Quite a few of our songs were licensed for overhead music around the planet and those have generated a little income. I’m able to see which companies, e.g., Mood Media licensed them. There is also a “compilation album” section and apparently this song was licensed through it although ST does not indicate the specific album. So nothing has been misappropriated ... so I can spend those couple of bucks in joy. ![[Linked Image from janiceandbud.com]](https://www.janiceandbud.com/uploads/4/4/3/1/44312/img-1053_orig.jpg)
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Yeah. That has happened to me too but I don’t think it was songtradr. I think it was my digital distributor (The Orchard)
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I'm hoping those royalties start rolling in soon.
I've got my eye on a Lamborghini...
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Starting in 2006 I tried doing whack-a-mole with various unauthorized sites making money from my music. I soon gave up. Now it’s worse, since my work as a composer or sideman is not even in the credits.
BIAB 2025 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 7 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6, Song Master Pro, Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Roland Integra-7, Presonus 192 & Faderport 8, Royer 121, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors.
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I'm hoping those royalties start rolling in soon.
I've got my eye on a Lamborghini... Maybe a used model toy in poor condition. 😀 Bud
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The state of the music business is total crap. Between the well past theft level of pay for streaming, to the scammers and totally dishonest ways of doing business, it's amazing that anyone is still writing songs.
But I guess it's not for the money.
Cool to think someone thought your song was good enough to want to put it on an album. Not paying for it is unconscionable. Obviously, they know how hard it would be to track them down for the royalties. That sux but it's a fact of life. You're not a real musician until you can say you have been ripped off. At least you aren't on tour playing to sold out arena crowds, getting paid $100 a week with a couple of number one hits making your business managers wealthy while you're staying in cheap hotels and eating beenie weenies out of the can with plastic spoons.
You can find my music at: www.herbhartley.comAdd nothing that adds nothing to the music. You can make excuses or you can make progress but not both. The magic you are looking for is in the work you are avoiding.
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In the music industry, for over 90% of the artists: - the gate-keepers have always made most of the money (publishers, record labels, streaming sites)
- there has always been piracy, from illegal fake books, recording songs from the radio, making cassette copies of LPs, and now digital
- plus pirate radio stations and now pirate streaming and download sites.
The performing artists get the crumbs off the table, unless you were the exception to the rule like Sinatra, Elvis, Beatles, M. Jackson, Ms. Swift. Even a number of stars got pimped. Labels owned the names of the artists and groups, so they could control everything. When I was gigging for Motown, there were multiple Temptations, Miracles, Marvelettes and others touring the country. Prince and Fogarty had to sue to use their own names. Fortunately, I've been a live performer all my life. We almost “made it big” once, but the record company wanted all our royalties (for recording, distribution and promotion). Plus they wanted to own our name, have exclusive publishing rights to anything we wrote, and put a fictional writer in to collect half the writing royalties. Our manager wanted a better contract, and the label quit talking to him. But we do it because we love it. Janice, Bud, and Floyd Jane, I hope it goes viral, and you make huge royalties from your efforts. Notes ♫
Bob "Notes" Norton Norton Music
https://www.nortonmusic.com
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The state of the music business is total crap. Between the well past theft level of pay for streaming, to the scammers and totally dishonest ways of doing business, it's amazing that anyone is still writing songs. I think to some degree it has always been crap. I think now we are more aware of how crap it is. Did anybody watch that film on Netflix about Spotify? They made a fortune, the record companies made a fortune and the long tail artists get less than zero.
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The state of the music business is total crap. Between the well past theft level of pay for streaming, to the scammers and totally dishonest ways of doing business, it's amazing that anyone is still writing songs. I think to some degree it has always been crap. I think now we are more aware of how crap it is. Did anybody watch that film on Netflix about Spotify? They made a fortune, the record companies made a fortune and the long tail artists get less than zero. Joanne, Is that the fictional series called The Playlist? We had thought about watching it. Or is there a documentary? We only found the former on Netflix. Thanks. Bud
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Bud. From what I understood is that it is based on a non-fiction book that tells the story of Spotify but the characters in the film are fictional.
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Bud. From what I understood is that it is based on a non-fiction book that tells the story of Spotify but the characters in the film are fictional. Thanks Joanne. We watch a lot of well reviewed series (never bingeing) so we'll add that to the list. Have you watched the newish four hour documentary on Joan Baez?
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Herb I laughed out loud at the Beenie weenies crack! Bud, I am so sad that you found this out! You guys obviously put a lot into your craft, and sadly thieves don't care. Just another example of the sad state of affairs in the world today. Just know that you guys make great music, and make a lot of people happy when they listen. Thanks for your hard work and dedication to music.
Lenovo Win 10 16 gig ram, Mac mini with 16 gig of ram, BiaB 2024, Realband, Reaper, Harrison Mixbus 32c , Melodyne 5 editor, Presonus Audiobox 1818VSL, Presonus control app, Komplete 49 key controller.
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The state of the music business is total crap. ... getting paid $100 a week with a couple of number one hits making your business managers wealthy while you're staying in cheap hotels and eating beenie weenies out of the can with plastic spoons. Reminds me of the movie One Trick Pony .. Paul Simon probably made more off of SNL than some of his later albums .. which is sad, because some of them were pretty good albums If anyone likes the old studio guys like Eric Gayle, Richard Tee, Steve Gadd, Tony Levin etc. .. it's an interesting watch with good music https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0081280/It ain't for everyone, but being a musician makes it much more relatable. .. I'm going to continue on here, but feel free to ignore, as what follows is all a hunch .. no facts I think the above movie was Paul's way of expressing frustration and making his own movie to complain .. was it critically acclaimed? No. But his point of writing all of this and going thru the effort is pretty clear. Shortly after he continued to push it with the recording companies and did the video with Chevy Chase on 'You can call me Al' tune .. kinda rubbing their nose in it. About the same time Chevy Chase made a solo album (pretty obscure) featuring parodies of Rappers Delight and I shot the sheriff, it was a pretty funny album at the time, but he used all studio musicians to create new versions (avoiding using previous recordings) .. and I think he joined in thumbing it to the recording companies Joe Pesci kind of the did same thing on his Vincent Laguardia Gambini album .. took a lot of 'old' school' type stuff and recreated it with his own band .. again it was funny, but this one requires more tolerance of language/approach to appreciate .. if you know Pesci, you can imagine There have been people who tried to express the frustration at the situation, with their own money (which makes commercial success very unlikely) .. but previous artists have done it. I wish more had supported them back then, just for the effort. That's why I said earlier that Paul probably made more off of SNL than a couple of his later albums; he was clearly frustrated
Last edited by rharv; 03/12/24 03:42 PM.
I do not work here, but the benefits are still awesome
Make your sound your own!
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The state of the music business is total crap. Between the well past theft level of pay for streaming, to the scammers and totally dishonest ways of doing business, it's amazing that anyone is still writing songs. I think to some degree it has always been crap. I think now we are more aware of how crap it is. Did anybody watch that film on Netflix about Spotify? They made a fortune, the record companies made a fortune and the long tail artists get less than zero. When I was younger, I was in a band that was the opening acts for groups like The Four Seasons, The Association, and eventually under the wing of Motown in its prime. We opened for Marvin Gaye, The Miracles, and eventually a few huge star-studded Motown Reviews. At the time, Bob Seger was making #1 hits on Detroit radio, so Berry wanted to expand his influence. We were chosen to be the first all-white act on the Motown family of labels. After a lot of negotiation, this was Motown's final offer: Our royalties were to be 2 cents per record or LP track. Out of our royalties, Motown would deduct - Exaggerated recording fees
- Inflated distribution costs
- Outrageous promotional fees
Plus - Motown would own all publishing rights
- We were to choose another name, one that Motown would own, and they would have the right to hire or fire anyone and have multiple bands touring with that name
- A ghostwriter who contributes nothing would be added to any song we wrote, and would receive half the songwriting royalties.
Now to be fair, 2¢ back then is more like $2 now, but everything else is more expensive today (For example, gas was 33¢ per gallon back then). The gatekeepers have always pimped the artists, and although the gatekeepers change through the years, their greed hasn't. The exception for deals like that would be, if your first effort went viral, and you became like Elvis, The Beatles, Taylor Swift or some of the others, you could negotiate a better deal for the next recording and get very wealthy. If not, you became just another one-hit, one-LP, one CD or one-album wonder. Me? I've made a living performing other people's music. I've played small dives, huge concert halls, cruise ships, show clubs, private parties, restaurants, yacht clubs, country clubs, retirement developments, singles bars, condominiums, shopping malls, and just about anywhere else a musician can be hired, including the roof of a gas station for its grand opening. I am a chameleon musician, playing 8 instruments and many genres. I've played rock, country, salsa, reggae, jazz, symphonies, and so on. Through the decades, I neither made it to the top, nor got rich. But on the other hand, I'm living life on my own terms, I'm not in debt, and I'm not a 5 day per week wage slave. I live modestly but I'm very happy. To me, this is a better way to live a life as a musician and I have no desire to chase the dream where I put in all the effort and the gatekeeper gets 99.999999% of the money. But that's just me. There is more than one right way to go through life. Insights and incites by Notes ♫
Bob "Notes" Norton Norton Music
https://www.nortonmusic.com
100% MIDI Super-Styles recorded by live, pro, studio musicians for a live groove
& Fake Disks for MIDI and/or RealTracks
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I've resolved the perceived issue with a little research. In 2018 I added several songs to Songtradr’s "monetization option." Quite a few of our songs were licensed for overhead music around the planet and those have generated a little income. I’m able to see which companies, e.g., Mood Media licensed them. There is also a “compilation album” section and apparently this song was licensed through it although ST does not indicate the specific album. So nothing has been misappropriated ... so I can spend those couple of bucks in joy. I would like to mention that all this is for fun. I’ve been retired for 25 years and could care less about income from our music. It’s all about the positive aspects of knowing that folks other than family and friends like our efforts. And hey, 10,000 plays on streaming platforms over the last year earned us a whopping $38.21. Bud
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I think we all do it for fun, even those of us who do it for a living.
I could have been an electronics engineer, and actually did that job for a Cable TV equipment manufacturer for a few years while testing out what it is to be normal. It paid much better than being a musician, but music called me back.
I hope your audience and your pleasure grows.
Notes ♫
Bob "Notes" Norton Norton Music
https://www.nortonmusic.com
100% MIDI Super-Styles recorded by live, pro, studio musicians for a live groove
& Fake Disks for MIDI and/or RealTracks
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I think we all do it for fun, even those of us who do it for a living.
I could have been an electronics engineer, and actually did that job for a Cable TV equipment manufacturer for a few years while testing out what it is to be normal. It paid much better than being a musician, but music called me back.
I hope your audience and your pleasure grows.
Notes ♫ We both retired years ago from the behavioral health field. During those years we frequently gigged at clubs and festivals. It would’ve been a lot more fun had we not had rather stressful employment. So nowadays with BiaB we are simply having fun with it all although no desire to gig again. The vast majority of our time is spent mountain biking and hiking. So as you mentioned the pleasure does grow. Audience? Well Janice was featured with her bio on Don’s Tunes webpage. He’s a popular blues rock Spotify playlister with nearly two million followers on YouTube … so if he were to decide to feature her in a video things could get interesting. 😀 Glad music called you back and play on! Bud
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Here where I live there is a song writer. He wrote a lot with Toby Keith (RIP) and was the co writer of many of Toby's big hits. We were talking a while back and he used to get BMI checks in the tens of thousands every single month. Then it started slowing up and then it was a trickle. There is no money in the traditional sense anymore. It is there for the huge artists. Those fractions of a penny from streaming add up to a lot when you get a billion streams (not an exaggeration just ask Taylor Swift). Rick Beato, like him or hate him, had a couple of good videos not too long ago about all this. The business side. He and Tim Pierce did one about the death of the middle class musician in the Los Angeles studio world. Just a crazy world now.
My wife asked if I had seen the dog bowl. I told her I didn't even know he could.
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<...snip...> Those fractions of a penny from streaming add up to a lot when you get a billion streams (not an exaggeration just ask Taylor Swift)<...> This is so true, for perhaps 1% of the people who write songs. The few who break out from the masses give us all some hope, and something to dream about. And a small percentage of us will get there. In a way, it's like playing the lottery, but it's a lot more creative, and if you are doing it right, a lot more fun. If you know the right people, you are a shoo in. If not, it's a matter of luck plus talent. Decades ago I was talking to Tom Scott. About 'making it', he said, and I'll paraphrase — that there is a sax player gigging in a Holiday Inn somewhere, like Valparaiso, Indiana, who could put me in his back pocket. But I had the right connections, I showed up in the right place at the right time, and I could do the job. I'm not trying to be a downer, just realistic. If you don't have the connections, don't get discouraged, it can happen, but just don't bank your future on it. Insights and incites by Notes ♫
Last edited by Notes Norton; 03/15/24 05:05 AM.
Bob "Notes" Norton Norton Music
https://www.nortonmusic.com
100% MIDI Super-Styles recorded by live, pro, studio musicians for a live groove
& Fake Disks for MIDI and/or RealTracks
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Great anecdote. I think Tom Scott may have been too modest - I have several of his first-class jazz funk albums - but I take your point.
BIAB 2025 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 7 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6, Song Master Pro, Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Roland Integra-7, Presonus 192 & Faderport 8, Royer 121, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors.
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For a number of years Tom Scott was everywhere with everybody .. connections don't do that, he knew his stuff
It would be a long, long list to try to find everything he either played on, or arranged for, including TV, movies, albums ..
from Steely Dan to Chevy Chase
I do not work here, but the benefits are still awesome
Make your sound your own!
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Never heard of the guy before googling him, but what a career he has had. Tom scott
Last edited by musiclover; 03/15/24 04:25 PM.
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I only met Tom that one time, and I really liked him.
We were playing at the Hyatt of the Palm Beaches, and he was in town leading the band for the Steve & Eydie show the next day. We chatted during our breaks and after the gig for a little while.
He's a good player, and I'm glad he had good connections so we can enjoy his music. (He is the son of film and television composer Nathan Scott, who had more than 850 television credits and more than 100 film credits as a composer, orchestrator, and conductor, including music for Dragnet and Lassie.)
He seems to have inherited a lot of talent from his dad as well.
And for the fictional sax player in Valparaiso, good luck!
The thing we have to all remember is no matter how good you are, there is always someone better, and always someone worse. Fame and fortune have nothing to do with that. But it's especially nice when fame finds a good artist.
Insights and incites by Notes ♫
Bob "Notes" Norton Norton Music
https://www.nortonmusic.com
100% MIDI Super-Styles recorded by live, pro, studio musicians for a live groove
& Fake Disks for MIDI and/or RealTracks
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The fun continues ... yesterday I discovered that one of our songs, Arcs of Life, is being used on Tik Tok. The song is about our feelings when exploring abandoned and forgotten cemeteries. It was used for a one minute video of an old cemetery. So the use is appropriate; however, no permission was sought from any source so it appears that we will lose a few more pennies. Such is life. Bud
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The fun continues ... yesterday I discovered that one of our songs, Arcs of Life, is being used on Tik Tok. I remember this great song, I think back in 2022. You must have mixed feelings. On the one hand, theft is taking place but on the other, you produced something worth stealing
https://soundcloud.com/user-646279677BiaB 2025 Windows For me there’s no better place in the band than to have one leg in the harmony world and the other in the percussive. Thank you Paul Tutmarc and Leo Fender.
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The fun continues ... yesterday I discovered that one of our songs, Arcs of Life, is being used on Tik Tok. I remember this great song, I think back in 2022. You must have mixed feelings. On the one hand, theft is taking place but on the other, you produced something worth stealing Glad you recalled and liked the tune. Your thoughts are a good way to look at it. Of course if real money was involved we might have a different perspective! J&B
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Theft and fraud are common conditions across the board here in the United States and elsewhere.
The last year I worked for the bank we lost $465, 000,000 in fraud.
A few weeks back I hired an electronics “expert” to help me sort out an issue with a new autopilot on my boat. Four hours later he said he did not know how to fix the issue but wanted his two hundred dollars per hour fee, in cash!
I had a couple of chooses. I could have shot him in the head with my 40 cal and shoved him overboard or driven him back to the dock and paided the [*****].
The music industry has been a particularly corrupt industry preying on the weak and uninformed.
I have never been a very accomplished musician but have been lucky enough to generate a few dollars from music.
I knew from day one that I wanted to make money and the things I really loved to do were very unlikely to provide me with the type of income I wanted. Yes, I made a few bucks from music, and evening more from my skills as a commercial pilot, the two things I like the most. But the real money came from working my butt off 100 hours a week in various business endeavors.
The last really fun gig…. I paid to have my keyboard player flown in from south America, the drummer from LA, Lewis from Dallas, and Tayna from Houston. We all find ways to enjoy the music we have the skills and money to produce. Home studio or PolyGram studios. Great music comes from both places.
At the end of the day it does not matter if the music is great or not for 99% of us. No one makes great music every time they decide to play. Do what you like, the way "you" want to!
And for all you stared eye kids who dream of making it big in the music business, it is really not that hard. All you need to do is sing at the level of Witney Houston, play guitar at the level of Jeff Beck, have the good looks of one of the most famous movie stars and not die of drug addiction before you make it.
Cheers,
Billy
Why do bagpipe players walk while they play?
To get away from the noise
What kind of music should you listen to while fishing? Something catchy!
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You forgot to add, know the right people and/or be in the right place at the right time.
I've known a lot of good-looking, great singers and fine musicians who didn't make it big. But it's not the only way. I've known musicians who make a lot of money playing music and others who need a day job to pay the bills.
I've made a living doing music and nothing but music for most of my life. I could have done better if I stayed in the electronics tech/engineering industry that I trained for, but 5 years of that convinced me I'd be happier staying with music. Though I live modestly, I have no debt, and I'm happier this way.
There is more than one way to do it.
Playing music puts you in the category of other professionals. Not every lawyer makes the big time, some do well and some barely get by.
Bands are like other small businesses, some fail, some make a decent living at it, and some hit the big time.
I think if anyone can make a living doing what they would do for free, and doing what they truly enjoy, they are better off than most people — and if they get rich in the process, they join the lucky ones.
Notes ♫
Bob "Notes" Norton Norton Music
https://www.nortonmusic.com
100% MIDI Super-Styles recorded by live, pro, studio musicians for a live groove
& Fake Disks for MIDI and/or RealTracks
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Off-Topic
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Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 971
Expert
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Expert
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 971 |
Thanks for the conversation. It's always of great interest to learn what others are doing with their music and how they're doing it. I've decided to distribute a few songs beyond SoundCloud and have been searching and sifting through these threads on the forums. There's so much to do. Distribute. Claim Artist Profiles. Pitch to Playlists (or not). Photos. Banners. Social Media Accounts. Performance Rights Organizations. On the one hand it's fun learning all about it, but on the other hand it's a fair amount of work.
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Off-Topic
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Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 9,874
Veteran
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Veteran
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 9,874 |
To add to the "what it takes to make it" conversation..... there's a lot of talent playing on the street corners and for tips in joints like Tootsies in Nashville that are better than any of the handful of touring acts from the same town who will never have a hit single on the radio.
Being in the right place at the right time and having the right friends around and above you kinda makes a huge difference in your chances.
You can find my music at: www.herbhartley.comAdd nothing that adds nothing to the music. You can make excuses or you can make progress but not both. The magic you are looking for is in the work you are avoiding.
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Ask sales and support questions about Band-in-a-Box using natural language.
ChatPG's knowledge base includes the full Band-in-a-Box User Manual and sales information from the website.
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Update your Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Windows® Today!
If you’ve already purchased Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Windows®, great news—a new update is now available! This update introduces a handy new feature: a vertical cursor in the Tracks window that shows the current location across all tracks, and more.
Discover everything included in this free update and download it now at https://www.pgmusic.com/support_windowsupdates.htm#1124
Video: Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Windows®: Boot Camp: The AI Lyrics Generator
With Band-in-a-Box 2025® for Windows®, we've introduced an exciting new feature: the AI Lyrics Generator! In this video, Tobin guides you step-by-step on how to make the most of this new tool.
Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Windows®: Boot Camp: The AI Lyrics Generator video.
Check out the forum post for more information.
Video: Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Windows®: Using VST3 Plugins
Band-in-a-Box 2025® for Windows® now includes support for VST3 plugins, bringing even more creative possibilities to your music production. Join Simon as he guides you through the process in this easy-to-follow demonstration!
Video: Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Windows®: Using VST3 Plugins
Join the conversation on our forum.
Video: Band-in-a-Box 2025 for Windows: Using The BB Stem Splitter!
In this video, Tobin provides a crash course on using the new BB Stem Splitter feature included in Band-in-a-Box 2025® for Windows®. During this process he also uses the Audio Chord Wizard (ACW) and the new Equalize Tempo feature.
Video: Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Windows®: Using the BB Stem Splitter
Check out the forum post for some optional Tips & Tricks!
Congrats to Misha (Rustyspoon)…downloaded/installed a full Audiophile 2025!
Breaking News!
We’re thrilled to announce that Rustyspoon has made PG history as the very first person to successfully complete the download and install of the full Band-in-a-Box 2025 Windows Audiophile Edition (with FLAC files)—a whopping 610GB of data!
A big shoutout to Rustyspoon for stepping up to be our test "elf!"
Thank you for your support, Rustyspoon!
Band-in-a-Box 2025 for Windows Videos
With the launch of Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Windows, we're adding new videos to our YouTube channel. We'll also share them here once they are published so you can easily find all the Band-in-a-Box® 2025 and new Add-on videos in one place!
Whether it's a summary of the new features, demonstrations of the 202 new RealTracks, new XPro Styles PAK 8, or Xtra Styles PAKs 18, information on the 2025 49-PAK, or detailed tutorials for other Band-in-a-Box® 2025 features, we have you covered!
Reference this forum post for One-Stop Shopping of our Band-in-a-Box® 2025 Videos - we will be updating this post as more videos are added!
Band-in-a-Box 2025 for Windows is Here!
Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Windows is here, packed with major new features and an incredible collection of available new content! This includes 202 RealTracks (in Sets 449-467), plus 20 bonus Unreleased RealTracks in the 2025 49-PAK. There are new RealStyles, MIDI SuperTracks, Instrumental Studies, “Songs with Vocals” Artist Performance Sets, Playable RealTracks Set 4, two new sets of “RealDrums Stems,” XPro Styles PAK 8, Xtra Styles PAK 19, and more!
Special Offers
Upgrade to Band-in-a-Box® 2025 with savings of up to 50% on most upgrade packages during our special—available until December 31, 2024! Visit our Band-in-a-Box® packages page for all the purchase options available.
2025 Free Bonus PAK & 49-PAK Add-ons
We've packed our Free Bonus PAK & 49-PAK with some incredible Add-ons! The Free Bonus PAK is automatically included with most Band-in-a-Box® for Windows 2025 packages, but for even more Add-ons (including 20 Unreleased RealTracks!) upgrade to the 2025 49-PAK for only $49. You can see the full lists of items in each package, and listen to demos here.
If you have any questions, feel free to connect with us directly—we’re here to help!
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