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Following your instructions I get the same output. I admit it looks strange, but I next opened the test song xml in Musescore and I think it all looked good (see picture). I even added a key change. I made the original song in F and when I changed to xml and opened in BIAB and in Musescore both stayed in F. I don't seen the 140 to 120 tempo change. But time signature changes look good. right? Also, BIAB uses some shaded chords in the opened xml, which I am not sure what that is supposed to mean. I am afraid I would have to spend a lot more time experimenting with this. But for now thats what I get. ![[Linked Image - Only viewable when logged in]](https://www.pgmusic.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=download&Number=27619&filename=xml opened in Musescore.png)
Last edited by DrDan; 03/14/24 12:31 AM.
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Thanks Dan, your confirmation is quite helpful. Yes, Musescore seems to handle the XML much better.
I'm not sure what the small '+' characters above the staves mean in Musescore. They occur only during the 3/4 time signature. At what bar did you introduce the key change?
I looked through all of the Display options for the differently shaded chords, but couldn't find anything that matched. Suffice to say, it doesn't work properly.
Thanks again for your input.
BIAB & RB2024 Win.(Audiophile), Sonar Platinum, Cakewalk by Bandlab, Izotope Prod.Bundle, Roland RD-1000, Synthogy Ivory, Kontakt, Focusrite 18i20, KetronSD2, NS40M Monitors, Pioneer Active Monitors, AKG K271 Studio H'phones
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I just found another, bigger problem, with Music XML That's much as I was alluding to with my " BIAB often(?) gets confused by cut time, and probably also by other non-4/4 time signatures". I couldn't at the time remember any specific examples and it was with 2023 anyway, which might(!) behave differently, but I think it does much as you show with many non-4/4 things. It can be tricky to be sure where the problem really lies without going through the MusicXML manually, which is hard work. An XML beautifier would likely help. My patience has worn too thin.
Jazz relative beginner, starting at a much older age than was helpful.
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Thanks Gordon for chipping in. In this case I suspect the problem is processing the incoming XML, as the chart Dan showed from importing the XML into Musescore appears to be quite correct. I think it's over to PGM now to get this sorted.
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It can depend quite a bit on how well, or not, the MusicXML parsing handles errors. Edit: I ran xmllint on the XML file AudioTrack posted on DropBox and it's reported as properly structured MusicXML 3.0.I've just rerun that test slightly differently and it reports a failure to load the "partwise.dtd", which may well mean that the first time it did nothing but a generic XML beautify.Hmm, yes, ... 404 error on: "http://www.musicxml.org/dtds/partwise.dtd" The tutorial on W3C shows a MusicXML "Hello World" tutorial, which has exactly the same URL to the DTD file. I know not if that's changed and not been updated or it it's simply that www.musicxml.org is broken at the moment. Game Over for now.
Last edited by Gordon Scott; 03/14/24 04:43 AM. Reason: Addendum
Jazz relative beginner, starting at a much older age than was helpful.
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Summary (so far) of proven repeatable (by many) import into BIAB issues:
- Wong Key <== root issue BIAB is importing in XML 3.0. All other apps are using 4.0.
- Wrong Time signature <== root issue BIAB is importing in XML 3.0. All other apps are using 4.0. I don't believe this is the case - as far as I can tell there were no changes in the MusicXML 3.1 and 4.0 spec regarding key or time signature. These issues are separate, and we are working on them. From reading that page, it seems like the MusicXML 4.0 spec is mostly about adding new features rather than removing old ones. There are a few deprecated elements from the 3.0 spec, but as far as I can tell we don't use those. Any MusicXML file that doesn't use the new features is still considered v4.0 compliant, provided it also doesn't use the deprecated elements. I also brought it into Musecore and exported it as mxl 4.0 and strangely enough it was close to accurate when importing into BIAB. The only variation was an extra part break at the end of the song. The extra part at the end is basically the difference between how BB and MusicXML structure a song, in that BB operates as "choruses" with the 2-bar ending happening outside of that, where MusicXML simply writes a bar at a time. When exporting a MusicXML file from BB, there is no way of flagging a particular bar as the "ending", so when that file is imported into BB it imports everything as the "chorus" - then, if you have automatic 2 bar endings enabled, BB adds that after the imported data. Since we can't rewrite the MusicXML spec, the only workaround I can think of here is if we added a "song length" field when importing a MusicXML file, similar to the bar offset field. I'll add that as a feature request, but for now this problem is solved by manually changing the song length after importing an XML.
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Why not have the import have an option for not adding the ending?
The time signature may be a related to Peter's dialog on the topic of Swing/triplets beats vs straight feel.
If I recall, some had some chord spelling issues with Maj 7, I think as well.
Studio One (latest version), Win 11 23H2 , i9 -10940X 3.3 GHz, 32GB Mem, a 4K 40" monitor, PreSonus Studio Live III Console as interface/controller. secondarily test on Reaper, Cakewalk, and S1 on Surface Pro 3 Win 10 (latest versions).
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Why not have the import have an option for not adding the ending? That's a good idea. I'll add that to my request. The time signature may be a related to Peter's dialog on the topic of Swing/triplets beats vs straight feel. I think there are two things at play here - first, Band-in-a-Box will always display 12/8 as 4/4, and second, there's a big difference between "importing" a MusicXML file and "opening" a MusicXML file. Importing assumes you want to keep whatever's already in your song (key, time sig, notation on other tracks, etc), where opening a MusicXML from the Open Special menu opens it as a fresh song. From the sounds of it, you're importing the MusicXML - try opening it from File > Open Special > Open MusicXML File. If I recall, some had some chord spelling issues with Maj 7, I think as well. As far as I can tell that's been fixed.
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I'm going to mark this thread as resolved, as we are working on the issues. They're in our database under the tracking numbers 4658, 4659, and 4660.
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I'm going to mark this thread as resolved, as we are working on the issues. They're in our database under the tracking numbers 4658, 4659, and 4660. Simon, an interesting approach. If I understand correctly, the issues have not yet actually been resolved, but they are marked as "resolved" based on the fact that the company is now aware of them and has given them tracking numbers. I wouldn't really label that as "resolved", certainly not yet anyway.
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If I recall, some had some chord spelling issues with Maj 7, I think as well. As far as I can tell that's been fixed. I was opening a MusicXML a day or two ago and BIAB was still dropping the "Major" from chords and falling back to a dominant. I'd created the MusicXML from Musescore 4 using the delta symbol, which may well be a factor the issue, but the MusicXML definitely identifies the chord as a major-seventh. I'm not sure what the text here is ... there's a Signe on this bar, so it may be that. <measure number="1">
<barline location="left">
<bar-style>heavy-light</bar-style>
<repeat direction="forward"/>
</barline>
<direction placement="above">
<direction-type>
<words font-family="Leland Text"></words>
</direction-type>
</direction>
<harmony print-frame="no">
<root>
<root-step>E</root-step>
<root-alter>-1</root-alter>
</root>
<kind use-symbols="yes">major-seventh</kind>
</harmony>
Jazz relative beginner, starting at a much older age than was helpful.
AVL:MXE Linux; Windows 11
BIAB2024 Audiophile, a bunch of other software.
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Simon, an interesting approach. If I understand correctly, the issues have not yet actually been resolved, but they are marked as "resolved" based on the fact that the company is now aware of them and has given them tracking numbers. I wouldn't really label that as "resolved", certainly not yet anyway. With long forum threads, other users are likely to not read the entire thread and instead jump in to try to fix something that they can't fix, which often causes confusion and threads going off topic - I've been asked to mark threads as Resolved to try and prevent that. Unfortunately our forum software doesn't have anything in between Resolved and not resolved. I was opening a MusicXML a day or two ago and BIAB was still dropping the "Major" from chords and falling back to a dominant. Can you email that file to support@pgmusic.com to my attention? I'll send it to the devs.
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. Unfortunately our forum software doesn't have anything in between Resolved and not resolved. OK, I follow. So in this case, something like "Under review" would be a nice-to-have.
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. Unfortunately our forum software doesn't have anything in between Resolved and not resolved. OK, I follow. So in this case, something like "Under review" would be a nice-to-have. I sure wish we were all working on this 3 months ago when the problems were being identified. As it is, I had several issues reported which at this time I can not confirm they have been added to the list. Either way, the status of "resolved" should be applied when the fix is implemented not when it is acknowledged.
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OK, I follow. So in this case, something like "Under review" would be a nice-to-have. Precisely. Our forum software doesn't have anything like that natively, but I'll try to figure something out. I sure wish we were all working on this 3 months ago when the problems were being identified. As it is, I had several issues reported which at this time I can not confirm they have been added to the list. I have a new position within the company specifically for this. I'm currently combing through the forums looking for such issues and will be adding them to the list, however if you know what the issues were I can double check. Please post them here if they're MusicXML related, or DM me if it's something else.
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I have a new position within the company specifically for this. I'm currently combing through the forums looking for such issues and will be adding them to the list, however if you know what the issues were I can double check. Now that is good news. Knowing that issues are being identified and providing feedback to the users has always been critical, but has been largely missing, except for the odd "Thanks". Definitely looking forward to more interaction. (Additionally there are significant references and explanations in the spreadsheet, but I'm sure you are aware of this  )
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Simon, thank you for telling us (and this is important) that things are moving in the right direction, nice to see you again!
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OK, I follow. So in this case, something like "Under review" would be a nice-to-have. Precisely. Our forum software doesn't have anything like that natively, but I'll try to figure something out. This is one of the reasons that a public-facing bug/issue tracker is useful, but I also understand why PGM seem reluctant to do that.
Jazz relative beginner, starting at a much older age than was helpful.
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BIAB2024 Audiophile, a bunch of other software.
Kawai MP6, Ui24R, Focusrite Saffire Pro40 and Scarletts
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Gordon, you had specific detailed issues. Are you sure those are all documented with Simon?
Studio One (latest version), Win 11 23H2 , i9 -10940X 3.3 GHz, 32GB Mem, a 4K 40" monitor, PreSonus Studio Live III Console as interface/controller. secondarily test on Reaper, Cakewalk, and S1 on Surface Pro 3 Win 10 (latest versions).
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Now that is good news. Knowing that issues are being identified and providing feedback to the users has always been critical, but has been largely missing, except for the odd "Thanks". Definitely looking forward to more interaction. Me too, it's a welcome change! (Additionally there are significant references and explanations in the spreadsheet, but I'm sure you are aware of this ) Absolutely  Simon, thank you for telling us (and this is important) that things are moving in the right direction, nice to see you again! Good to see you guys again too! This is one of the reasons that a public-facing bug/issue tracker is useful, but I also understand why PGM seem reluctant to do that. Yep, that's definitely not gonna happen. Gordon, you had specific detailed issues. Are you sure those are all documented with Simon? Gordon has sent me a file to test with notes - I'm checking it out now.
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