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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 496
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OP
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Posts: 496 |
I've got my version of Gladys Knight's "I Heard It Through The Grapevine" pretty much done, except for the iconic "C5 - - Eb5 - C5 G5 - F5 - Eb5" are playing as major chords rather than no 3rd. What can I do about this? These are Real Tracks playing.
Band-in-a-Box® for Windows
Version 2024 (1111)
64 bit application
RealBand 2024 (1)
Windows 10 Pro 64-bit
Intel Core i7 4800MQ @ 2.70GHz
Haswell 22nm Technology
16.0GB Dual-Channel DDR3 @ 798MHz (11-11-11-28)
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 496
Journeyman
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OP
Journeyman
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 496 |
Band-in-a-Box® for Windows
Version 2024 (1111)
64 bit application
RealBand 2024 (1)
Windows 10 Pro 64-bit
Intel Core i7 4800MQ @ 2.70GHz
Haswell 22nm Technology
16.0GB Dual-Channel DDR3 @ 798MHz (11-11-11-28)
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 18,999
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With no information about the Style or which RealTracks are in use it's difficult to know.
Playable RealTracks might be a solution for you.
BIAB & RB2024 Win.(Audiophile), Sonar Platinum, Cakewalk by Bandlab, Izotope Prod.Bundle, Roland RD-1000, Synthogy Ivory, Kontakt, Focusrite 18i20, KetronSD2, NS40M Monitors, Pioneer Active Monitors, AKG K271 Studio H'phones
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 496
Journeyman
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OP
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Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 496 |
I'm using the _SOULFUL.STY style. I like the groove, the sound. The instruments that are playing chords are 1435:Guitar, Electric, Rhythm JazzFunkGroovinChords EV16, along with 1437:Piano, Electric, Rhythm JazzFunkGroovin EV16.
I hadn't thought of Playable Real Tracks. That might work. However, shouldn't these Real Tracks play E5 when an E5 chord is selected? I understand that many people find a power chord more appropriate for a Hard Rock tune, but as one can hear, it's being used in a classic soul tune. Why wouldn't they sample a chord with no 3rd for the E5 chord?
Now, as I try to edit in Playable Real Tracks, I realize that this piano part doesn't come with a transcription of the notes. What is the point of this being a Playable Real Track if I can't see the notes that are there to edit them?
Last edited by Funkifized; 06/26/24 06:03 PM.
Band-in-a-Box® for Windows
Version 2024 (1111)
64 bit application
RealBand 2024 (1)
Windows 10 Pro 64-bit
Intel Core i7 4800MQ @ 2.70GHz
Haswell 22nm Technology
16.0GB Dual-Channel DDR3 @ 798MHz (11-11-11-28)
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 19,117
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Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 19,117 |
When I disable Natural Arrangements in Song Settings, the electric piano played E5 for me.
I also tried the progression "C5 - - Eb5 - C5 G5 - F5 - Eb5" that you mentioned with the Song Settings adjusted, the electric piano played fine.
When I had Natural Arrangements set to either "Enabled" or "As set in arrangement options", major chords were generated.
MY SONGS...Audiophile BIAB 2024
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Jul 2000
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I think Noel is onto something here. I wrote a short article on this that mentions Natural Arrangement as one of several things you can try: https://www.pgmusic.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=694482#Post694482
BIAB 2024 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 6.5 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6; Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Roland Integra-7, Presonus Studio 192, Presonus Faderport 8, Royer 121, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Apr 2002
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OP
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I'm not near my computer right now. Is this "Natural Arrangement" setting per instrument, or a setting for the whole song?
Band-in-a-Box® for Windows
Version 2024 (1111)
64 bit application
RealBand 2024 (1)
Windows 10 Pro 64-bit
Intel Core i7 4800MQ @ 2.70GHz
Haswell 22nm Technology
16.0GB Dual-Channel DDR3 @ 798MHz (11-11-11-28)
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 26,179
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Posts: 26,179 |
BIAB 2024 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 6.5 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6; Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Roland Integra-7, Presonus Studio 192, Presonus Faderport 8, Royer 121, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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OK, I'm going to rant (please ignore) that a power chord is not a chord, it is an interval. It takes 3 notes to make a chord. (rant is over).
This is one reason why I prefer MIDI styles to real tracks, I can export the finished BiaB product and edit to my heart's content. In this instance, open it up in the piano roll editor and erase the thirds in the major triad, turning them into a root/fifth interval (power chord).
BiaB is wonderful, bordering on pure genius. I've written styles for other auto accompaniment apps, and BiaB is by far the absolute best.
But as great as BiaB's output is, IMO it's not ready for prime time. It's like a very good band, but not an excellent band. In MIDI, granted you suffer a little tone, but you gain a huge opportunity for extensive editing. You can take that very good output and make something truly exceptional with it. Besides for fixing power chords, I can move drum rolls around, put real intros/endings on the song, insert song specific licks, do more than just shots/holds, change the instrument say from a piano to a clav or a jazz guitar to a telecaster, altering or changing the volumes of individual notes, change the chord inversion to help the singer, and so much more. This can make the music much more expressive.
Tone is subjective, and expression rules. After all, there are plenty of pop singers with less than stellar voices that are very popular, because they express themselves well. And who can say that the strat guitar sounds better than the 335 or the LP, or the tele or the danelectro?
But with a real track, which I occasionally use, I know of no way to get rid of any notes in a chord.
It's not the fault of BiaB, it's the difference between MIDI and recorded audio, and the technology of the day.
Insights, incites (and minor rants) by Notes ♫
Bob "Notes" Norton  Norton Music
https://www.nortonmusic.com
100% MIDI Super-Styles recorded by live, pro, studio musicians for a live groove
& Fake Disks for MIDI and/or RealTracks
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 496
Journeyman
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OP
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Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 496 |
I agree with you about power chords, but they are being used in place of "real" chords, and the Gladys Knight version of Grapevine is a great example. The iconic riff of the tune is always played with open 5ths, regardless of which version of the tune, but as the open 5ths move up a minor 3rd, the assumption is that this is a minor key, which it is not. Adding major 3rds to these "chords" gives a different flavor to the music.
Playable Tracks allows for the mixture of MIDI notes with the Real Tracks, so the added major 3rds can be edited out, but then some Real Tracks don't have transcriptions of the notes, so one can't edit the "playable" track.
Frustrating.
Band-in-a-Box® for Windows
Version 2024 (1111)
64 bit application
RealBand 2024 (1)
Windows 10 Pro 64-bit
Intel Core i7 4800MQ @ 2.70GHz
Haswell 22nm Technology
16.0GB Dual-Channel DDR3 @ 798MHz (11-11-11-28)
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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........................................
But with a real track, which I occasionally use, I know of no way to get rid of any notes in a chord.
.................................by Notes ♫ Notes, I completely agree with you with the exception of the above line. You can get rid of RT notes BUT it takes a program like the polyphonic version of Melodyne to do it.
Inflation is so bad that CEOs are now playing miniature golf!
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 6,183
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I tried Melodyne a long time ago, and it was hit or miss. Some tracks rendered faithfully, and others had either too many or too few notes rendered. Perhaps it's been improved through the years.
BTW, although the Marvin Gaye version became more popular, I agree with Berry Gordy on this one and favor the Gladys Knight version.
When we learned it, we were closer to the Gladys version, but it didn't go over that well, so we changed to Marvin's arrangement (both with our touches added)
Notes ♫
Bob "Notes" Norton Norton Music
https://www.nortonmusic.com
100% MIDI Super-Styles recorded by live, pro, studio musicians for a live groove
& Fake Disks for MIDI and/or RealTracks
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In this PAK you'll find: dubby reggae grooves, rootsy Americana, LA jazz pop, driving pop rock, mellow electronica, modern jazz fusion, spacey country ballads, Motown shuffles, energetic EDM, and plenty of synth heavy grooves! Xtra Style PAK 18 features these styles and many, many more!
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Note: The Xtra Styles require the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box®. (Xtra Styles PAK 18 requires the 2024 UltraPAK/UltraPAK+/Audiophile Edition. They will not work with the Pro or MegaPAK version because they need the RealTracks from the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition.
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Here's a small sampling of what XPro Styles PAK 7 has to offer: energetic rock jigs, New Orleans funk, lilting jazz waltzes, fast Celtic punk, uptempo train beats, gritty grunge, intense jazz rock, groovy EDM, soulful R&B, soft singer-songwriter pop, country blues rock, and many more!
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