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I always run my RME ASIO driver at a 48K sample rate with a buffer size of 128. ALL of my other audio software (DAWs, standalone virtual instruments, performance apps, notation software, etc.) are configured for 48K. When I run BiaB, it not only forces the sample rate to 44.1K, but somehow locks the RME driver into that sample rate, so I can't change it back to 48K.
In BiaB's Audio properties window, it says that 48K is a supported sample rate, but I can't find where to set BiaB to 48K.
Help please!
Last edited by TheMaartian; 10/27/24 11:46 PM.
ThinkPad i9 32GB RAM 7TB SSD; Win11 Pro; RME Fireface UCX II; BiaB 2024 Ultra
Bitwig Studio 5; Studio One Pro 7; Melodyne Studio 5; Acoustica Premium 7
Gig Performer 5; NI S61 MK3; Focal Shape 65; Beyerdynamic DT 880 & 770
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M.
what is win os sound set to ? recording and playback...44.1 ? or 48 ?
i understand bb is happy with 44.1 so i use that.
bb prolly defaults to the win os setting....
i ensure always the interface and the desktop app for it and win os are 44.1 .
Last edited by justanoldmuso; 10/28/24 02:58 AM.
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I always run my RME ASIO driver at a 48K sample rate with a buffer size of 128. ALL of my other audio software (DAWs, standalone virtual instruments, performance apps, notation software, etc.) are configured for 48K. When I run BiaB, it not only forces the sample rate to 44.1K, but somehow locks the RME driver into that sample rate, so I can't change it back to 48K.
In BiaB's Audio properties window, it says that 48K is a supported sample rate, but I can't find where to set BiaB to 48K.
Help please! As I understand this, BiaB supports 44.1kHz internally and will use a sample-rate convertor if the hardware does not support 44.1kHz. If the hardware supports 44.1kHz, BiaB will change it to that rate. I believe there is no option to choose 48kHz elsewhere than for the final rendering. This has been a long-standing criticism of BiaB. Quite what happens if, for example, BiaB refuses to use 48kHz and some other software refuses to use 44.1kHz, I know not. I rather hope someone will tell me I'm wrong and behind the current situation, but I think I'm not.
Jazz relative beginner, starting at a much older age than was helpful.
AVL:MXE Linux; Windows 11
BIAB2024 Audiophile, a bunch of other software.
Kawai MP6, Ui24R, Focusrite Saffire Pro40 and Scarletts
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There's a post here from Simon that might help: https://www.pgmusic.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=655362#Post655362From the FAQ: You might try changing the 'ASIO always on' setting in the Band-in-a-Box® ASIO Audio Drivers dialog to OFF. The ideal setting is ON, because this allows low latency play-thru while the song is stopped, however it may cause problems with some drivers when always on. Also, try setting the resampler quality to Fast. Band-in-a-Box® plays audio at 44.1 KHz sample rate, but some ASIO drivers only support higher sample rates, so Band-in-a-Box® automatically resamples the audio to the native format of the ASIO driver. Fast will use less processing power. ... suggests that if you can use WAS or MME, BiaB should be compatible with 48kHz hardware and if you must use ASIO, changing the resampler rate might help.
Last edited by Gordon Scott; 10/28/24 04:12 AM. Reason: added a bit.
Jazz relative beginner, starting at a much older age than was helpful.
AVL:MXE Linux; Windows 11
BIAB2024 Audiophile, a bunch of other software.
Kawai MP6, Ui24R, Focusrite Saffire Pro40 and Scarletts
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Gordon. tell me if the following makes sense or not as to bb and 48k and asio. 1..it might seem on the surface that as other music apps support 48k asio bb should. however... 2..maybe..and only pg can answer on this (and tell me i'm full of it...lol.) at the programming code level in bb there is the fact that bb is executing auto accompany features which the other music apps arent. sooo...its easier in typical daw apps ? dunno. the tecchy in me would love to know. do you think i'm wrong gordon i DO know lots of people want 48k due to video work. the problem with was driver is that it has higher latency... there are various articles on the net re asio vs wasapi. eg... https://www.sweetwater.com/sweetcare/articles/roland-difference-between-asio-wdm-mme-drivers/?msockid=174d8d37e56467091e9399dde4ce667bjust google. as i understand it wasapi is great if only a playback environment but for recording asio is preferable due to lower latency. happiness. om
Last edited by justanoldmuso; 10/28/24 05:48 AM.
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Having started to try to answer this, I'm now begining to doubt my own understanding of it. I'm starting to wonder if I'm talking nonsense by getting two or three different aspects of BiaB's behaviour mixed up. The ambiguity of the manual et al doesn't help. Yes, I think we need an answer or steer from PGM. Maniacal LOL ... well it is almost Hallowe'en. 
Jazz relative beginner, starting at a much older age than was helpful.
AVL:MXE Linux; Windows 11
BIAB2024 Audiophile, a bunch of other software.
Kawai MP6, Ui24R, Focusrite Saffire Pro40 and Scarletts
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M.
what is win os sound set to ? recording and playback...44.1 ? or 48 ?
i understand bb is happy with 44.1 so i use that.
bb prolly defaults to the win os setting....
i ensure always the interface and the desktop app for it and win os are 44.1 . I have Windows configured for 48K, the same as my RME ASIO driver. I have Windows configured to use the Main outputs of the Fireface for audio output. So, those settings match, until I run BiaB, which gives me a message in one of those little yellow boxes in the lower right of the BiaB windows, telling me that the audio interfaces settings have been changed.
ThinkPad i9 32GB RAM 7TB SSD; Win11 Pro; RME Fireface UCX II; BiaB 2024 Ultra
Bitwig Studio 5; Studio One Pro 7; Melodyne Studio 5; Acoustica Premium 7
Gig Performer 5; NI S61 MK3; Focal Shape 65; Beyerdynamic DT 880 & 770
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I always run my RME ASIO driver at a 48K sample rate with a buffer size of 128. ALL of my other audio software (DAWs, standalone virtual instruments, performance apps, notation software, etc.) are configured for 48K. When I run BiaB, it not only forces the sample rate to 44.1K, but somehow locks the RME driver into that sample rate, so I can't change it back to 48K.
In BiaB's Audio properties window, it says that 48K is a supported sample rate, but I can't find where to set BiaB to 48K.
Help please! I believe there is no option to choose 48kHz elsewhere than for the final rendering. This has been a long-standing criticism of BiaB. Quite what happens if, for example, BiaB refuses to use 48kHz and some other software refuses to use 44.1kHz, I know not. I rather hope someone will tell me I'm wrong and behind the current situation, but I think I'm not. OK, but then what does this mean (what the red arrow is pointing to)? ![[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]](https://i.imgur.com/8FY4v0K.jpg)
Last edited by TheMaartian; 10/28/24 07:24 AM.
ThinkPad i9 32GB RAM 7TB SSD; Win11 Pro; RME Fireface UCX II; BiaB 2024 Ultra
Bitwig Studio 5; Studio One Pro 7; Melodyne Studio 5; Acoustica Premium 7
Gig Performer 5; NI S61 MK3; Focal Shape 65; Beyerdynamic DT 880 & 770
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One of the reasons I spent 1 400 € to replace my PreSonus 1810c with an RME Fireface UCX II for their superb multi-client ASIO driver. But with BiaB changing the sample rate of my ASIO driver, if I try to run something else at the same time, it'll throw up a config error or (horror of horrors), change it's own sample rate setting to 44.1K, leaving me to sort through that after the fact.
I'm not too happy about this, but big thanks to those of you replying to my question and helping out!
Last edited by TheMaartian; 10/28/24 07:30 AM.
ThinkPad i9 32GB RAM 7TB SSD; Win11 Pro; RME Fireface UCX II; BiaB 2024 Ultra
Bitwig Studio 5; Studio One Pro 7; Melodyne Studio 5; Acoustica Premium 7
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Contact PGM via their on-line chat or email support@
Perhaps Simon or someone with similar knowledge can help.
What I can say with confidence is that with my Focusrire device, if I change my driver from WAS to ASIO, BiaB changes the device's 48kHz sample rate to 44.1kHz, despite the resampling set to "Best".
Jazz relative beginner, starting at a much older age than was helpful.
AVL:MXE Linux; Windows 11
BIAB2024 Audiophile, a bunch of other software.
Kawai MP6, Ui24R, Focusrite Saffire Pro40 and Scarletts
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M and Gordon.
i use an audient interface with multiclient driver ...nary a prob in any music app.
i set it to 48k asio. nope.no go...it gets reset to 44.1k.
so Mr M same prob here....i get a bb message... 44.1 fine.
Mr M...you asked why in bb asio 48k is listed at bottom.
same here BUT i believe that asio dialog just lists the interface/driver capabilities.
i may be wrong but it doesnt necessarily mean that bb can utilise 48k ?
now heres a 'likkle wrinkle' ...and i might be out to lunch as i use only 44.1 whether bb or rb or reaps v2 that i also use...
in my dim getting older memory did someone mention once 48 k can be used in rb ?
but maybe i'm wrong.
i'm busy with songs right ...and dont wanna muck around with my settings...
but if your feeling bold Mr M see if you get the same 48k prob in rb.
i would be curious.
i feel on this pg site...a memo/sticky re this issue be issued as i'm sure this is gonna crop up again..
particularly with new users i guess.
happiness.
om
Last edited by justanoldmuso; 10/28/24 04:05 PM.
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M and Gordon.
i use an audient interface with multiclient driver ...nary a prob in any music app.
i set it to 48k asio. nope.no go...it gets reset to 44.1k.
so Mr M same prob here....i get a bb message... 44.1 fine.
Mr M...you asked why in bb asio 48k is listed at bottom.
same here BUT i believe that asio dialog just lists the interface/driver capabilities.
i may be wrong but it doesnt necessarily mean that bb can utilise 48k ?
now heres a 'likkle wrinkle' ...and i might be out to lunch as i use only 44.1 whether bb or rb or reaps v2 that i also use...
in my dim getting older memory did someone mention once 48 k can be used in rb ?
but maybe i'm wrong.
i'm busy with songs right ...and dont wanna muck around with my settings...
but if your feeling bold Mr M see if you get the same 48k prob in rb.
i would be curious.
i feel on this pg site...a memo/sticky re this issue be issued as i'm sure this is gonna crop up again..
particularly with new users i guess.
happiness.
om OK, I switched BiaB to WAS (always) audio. Now, my ASIO driver remains at 48K, and BiaB uses 48K for both Input and Output audio, even though audio output is going to the monitors connected to my RME audio interface. [shrug] I don't understand, but I'm happy now! Thanks everyone! P.S. I don't even install RealBand. Since I use Bitwig and Studio One, both of which support the BiaB plugin, I don't need it. Also, I'd been using Reaper for over 10 years, but I hadn't even opened it since getting Bitwig 5, so I uninstalled it. Was installing Reaper completely as simple and easy as installing it? Nope. It took me over 30 minutes just to clean up all of the Reaper entries in the Windows Registry. Over 30 freaking minutes! Unbelievable. There were entries for every single update to Reaper since the first version of v4 that I installed. And I was on the latest version of Reaper 7 when I uninstalled it. Lordy, but that was time-consuming and irritating.
Last edited by TheMaartian; 10/29/24 01:30 AM.
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Bitwig Studio 5; Studio One Pro 7; Melodyne Studio 5; Acoustica Premium 7
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OK, I switched BiaB to WAS (always) audio. Now, my ASIO driver remains at 48K, and BiaB uses 48K for both Input and Output audio, even though audio output is going to the monitors connected to my RME audio interface. [shrug]
I don't understand, but I'm happy now! Thanks everyone! OK, well that's good at least. Hopefully you'll also still get the low-latency you expect. Mr M...you asked why in bb asio 48k is listed at bottom.
same here BUT i believe that asio dialog just lists the interface/driver capabilities.
i may be wrong but it doesnt necessarily mean that bb can utilise 48k ? I'd also been thinking device capability, but for my device it lists 22050 <no>, 44100<yes>, 48000<yes> and 96000<yes>, but not the 88200 that it also supports. I don't see 22050 in the USB audio specs, though there's a lot to search. My guess on this is that BiaB enquires only about sample rates it can handle directly or with the resampler, then uses the "directly" 44.1kHz if available or the resampler only if 44.1kHz is not available. It seems to me very remiss to force a sample rate on the user, especially if there's a resampler built in. I guess PGM would argue that no resampling gives better audio quality, which is probably true but not necessarily helpful.
Jazz relative beginner, starting at a much older age than was helpful.
AVL:MXE Linux; Windows 11
BIAB2024 Audiophile, a bunch of other software.
Kawai MP6, Ui24R, Focusrite Saffire Pro40 and Scarletts
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M and Gordon.weeeelll...lol..
(ive gone into a bit of detail in case potential new users are reading this topic.)
heres a perspective on things i suspect that are going on.
please feel free to tell me i'm a 'stupid A'....
1..in a typical daw there arent the same 'wrinkles' as bb.
one isnt comparing apples to apples. a typical daw isnt 'stitching together' bits from
a library of content...whereas...
2..bb is building tracks by 'stitching together' from a lib of content.
given the above if the content lib is set to a different sampling rate than the users preferred sample rate then obviously the added wrinkle is resampling routines right ?
this might lead to lag if the user is regenerating lots of tracks on a clunky pc ?
an added wrinkly is the driver technology and the users choice of interface which pg have no control over (same with the win OS.).
in summary for the poor app coder in some ways he/she is in a catch 22 due to limitations placed on he/she.
now what i'm wondering is how big the latency when regenerating oodles of tracks when the app doesnt have to resample the library content (cos sample rate is same as users set sample rate) versus when the app must resample cos the library content is a DIFFERENT sampling rate than the users sample rate set in preferences. so in the former case all is fine if content lib is 44.1 and user 44.1.
in second case content lib is 44.1k but users is 48k.
see what i mean ? does the resampling process introduce added latency due to the coder haveing to call up resampling routines ?
given the above we know that asio is lower latency than wasapi.
so the added wrinkle is what added impact does this have ?
as i said from my looking at things it seems that wasapi is fine for playback environments but asio beats it for recording.
also i'm wondering in conclusion if bb had oodles of tracks...lets take 38 for example to regenerate how much lag would be introduced whereby the users set sample rate was the SAME as the content lib versus when the users sample rate is DIFFERENT than the content libray <<< so resampling is needed.
i hope i make some sense.
Mr M. re reaps. hmm never given me a prob.
(actually i'm useing it less and less these days due to rb recent improvements.
i dont use bb plugin as rb for me has way more features. i just D n D from rb to other apps.
re Bitwig <<< interesting daw. particularly re the clap plugin implementation that apparently is better than vst ??. frankly i'm intrigued by some of the things that
multitrackstudio.com is doing includeing cross platform plus ipad support.
i really like how so many great features have been implemented within such a small
exe footprint. (btw what latency is reported for your new RME interface ?
RME is good kit. i'm very happy with audient (love the drivers) around 4ms asio here.)
happiness.
om
Last edited by justanoldmuso; 10/29/24 03:16 AM.
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As PG Music are the ultimate experts on this, it would be good if they could chime in with some definitive suggestions on how to really resolve the O/P's issue. They often come on board with the right answers when we all spend much time and experimenting with efforts that might only be guesses at best.
PGM?
Last edited by AudioTrack; 10/29/24 04:28 AM.
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M and Gordon.weeeelll...lol..
(ive gone into a bit of detail in case potential new users are reading this topic.)
...
(btw what latency is reported for your new RME interface ? RME is good kit.
... With a 48K sample rate and a block size of 128 samples, Bitwig is reporting a latency of 2.67 mS. Pretty darn good!
ThinkPad i9 32GB RAM 7TB SSD; Win11 Pro; RME Fireface UCX II; BiaB 2024 Ultra
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Mr M and Gordon and all.
well this is interesting...AND WORKS !!
1..i set win plus my interface plus realband (rb) to default
48 k. and rb is ASIO.
2..then i genned backing tracks and recorded a scratch vocal in rb.
all good...this is freaking me out. why probs with bb
but not rb ?
ive rechecked my settings several times...yep...
48k asio works.
maybe someone else can confirm...rharv ? rob ?
other rb users ?
now i'm wondering if ive got a false postive...lol...
so i would be gratefull if someone would check that in fact in
rb 48k asio works.
Mr M...yes impressive low latency. i could push it lower with audient
but i dont bother as all is copacetic.
i understand the internal latency of my audient is less than 1ms.
this whole thing is freaky.
simon ...if your reading this am i correct that 48k asio is no prob
in rb but a prob in bb ?
if i'm correct then for people doing sound for 48k video
then rb is a better bet for genning tracks ?
i'm getting no warnings here or crashes with 48k asio.
go figure.
maybe i'll get egg on my face..
just concerned as i get older i might miss something...lol.
Mr M if you could do a test in rb 48k asio i would love to know
if it works fine with the rme <<<< excellent product.
happiness.
om
ps what is freaking me out is i thouight rb uses in the background the bb generation engine ? theres some goofy stuff going on. but if truly rb works asio 48k then this should be pointed out in a faq for people doing 48 k work and tracks for video work....its a big plus for rb.
dont ya love tech ?...lmao.
Last edited by justanoldmuso; 10/29/24 09:42 AM.
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all good...this is freaking me out. why probs with bb
but not rb ? I think the short answer is because PGM elected to handle the two tools differently. A policy difference or oversight in BiaB. PGM say BiaB will resample if the device does not support 44.1kH, but they don't say what will happen if the device does supoport 44.1kHz. The answer on BiaB appears to be "change the interface data rate to 44.1kHz". ps what is freaking me out is i thouight rb uses in the background the bb generation engine ? But probably then resamples just before passing the data to the device.
Jazz relative beginner, starting at a much older age than was helpful.
AVL:MXE Linux; Windows 11
BIAB2024 Audiophile, a bunch of other software.
Kawai MP6, Ui24R, Focusrite Saffire Pro40 and Scarletts
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Gordon.
i think your onto something.
my concern is for a new non tech user trying to figure out things when even us techs are wrestling with trying to figure it all out.
or maybe as i get older...lol...i'm now out to lunch.
good point re resampling.
all i can conclude at this juncture is for some reason rb is ok with with 48k but bb no can do.
once i reverted bb to 44.1k all was ok.
i'm curious where the bb or rb app is picking up sound interface capabilities from.
i guess win os audio advanced settings....right ?
one thing that really impressed me about audient was when i got my new audient interface and installed drivers etc etc both rb and bb i had no faffing around with.
both rb and bb picked up the default audient device.
it was a pleasant change from previous years when i might have to faff around with settings when i installed a new interface.
happiness.
om
Last edited by justanoldmuso; 10/29/24 12:43 PM.
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i'm curious where the bb or rb app is picking up sound interface capabilities from.
i guess win os audio advanced settings....right ? Hmm, maybe. There's Windows and BiaB history, Delphi ands its history, and Windows APIs that in my limited(*) and jaundiced experience don't actually work as they should. (*) I'm a Linux guy ... ALSA does much of the low-level stuff.
Jazz relative beginner, starting at a much older age than was helpful.
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Mr M and Gordon.
for s's and giggles i wanted to install bitwig trial set it to 48k same as rb.
then pound sand genning loads of tracks in rb and D n' Ding from rb into bitwig.
but after a nice easy peasy bitwig download/install then it displays a screen i gotta set up an account. so i gave up...sadly.
drives me bonkers all, this email/registering/personal deets etc.
so Mr M heres what i suggest...
1. rb is no different than bb. loads of generation of audio and midi tracks options.
so...if you know bb you should have no probs. just ignore the advanced rb features.
(to save me typing go thru the rb manual on this site and see what cranks you up.)
2..set up both bitwig and rb as 48k...and run some tests genning tracks in rb and dropping into bitwig and see if it works to your satisfaction. you never know if you like this approach till you try it...
(btw bitwig DOES look good and i like the clap plugin tech approach.)
happiness....and to all merry upcoming xmas.
om
Last edited by justanoldmuso; 10/29/24 04:02 PM.
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Mr M and Gordon and all.
YES 48K SUCCESS !!
heres what i did.
(this assumes that the users daw of choice supports drag/drop from another music app. otherwise its old skool export from rb to the other daw.)
1..i set win audio and rb and reaper to 48k.
(reaps and rb both useing asio 48k for very low latency.)
2..i set up a common dir for all content...ie for project saves/files/gens/recordings.
IE A COMMON DIRE FOR REAPS AND RB. so all is neat and tracks arent all over the place.
eg if song is called 'i wanna rock till dawn' then a dir is set up that holds all content from rb and reaps (or your daw) for the i wanna rock song.
VERY IMPORTANT >>>> in rb plugin options i set the dir NOT to default rb drag/drop but to the...
'i wanna rock till dawn' dir ie my song dir shared by all music apps.
3..VERY IMPORTANT...
!! MAKE SURE RB AND THE DAW ARE SET TO SAME TEMPO.
!! MAKE SURE YOU USE THE SAME MARKER NAMING IN BOTH RB
AND THE DAW. so all matches. eg if a marker is called 'guitar lead break'
in rb then same marker name in your daw.
useing the above set up i genned rts/tracks in rb and then just dragged the track numbers into reaps. (its fast.).
et voila 48k tracks in reaps.
SO lets summarise.
if a user wishes to do a song project in 48k..
(eg for film or video etc) assuming the non rb daw does 48k and has drag/drop.
voila ! it can be done.
note before posting the above in pg tips forum could some kind soul test/replicate and tell me no probs. i get no probs here. use any daw you want as long as it supports 48k and drag/drop.
(note i couldnt test bitwig because my production pc for songs is sandboxed and doesnt go on the net for the bitwig account set up process required.
however assuming bitwig supports drag/drop and 48k which i'm sure it must then bitwig (or any other daw ) should work.
(second note... for me i find the rb as track generator method serving up genned tracks to another daw is more flexible than useing bb plugin.)
(note for those who dont want to learn another app like rb.if you know bb you shouldnt have a problem. its the same in rb as bb ie generate tracks then serve them up to your other daw.)
anyhoo. voila ! please report back to me if you get probs.
hth/happiness.
om
Last edited by justanoldmuso; 10/30/24 03:58 AM.
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SEE MY PREVIOUS POST FIRST.
ok i got bitwig in demo mode installed on my internet computer.
(as i said my production pc is sandboxed.)
and tested/dragged and dropped the rb generated tracks into bitwig.
then i tried multitrackstudio.com same...worked.
so includeing reaper thats 3 daws that work.
but Mr M run your own tests. or anyone else with a different daw.
eg S1 or another.
just follow the steps i outlined in my previous post.
i'll post in tips section once others have confirmed success.
ps...mario..if you would be kind enough and have time. it will be a doddle for you.
please confirm all works in S1. (just follow my steps in previous post.)
tell me if S1 works.
happiness.
om
Last edited by justanoldmuso; 10/30/24 05:54 AM.
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om, I'd be glad to help. I have printed your instructions and will attempt it later today. Note that it is unusually warm here for this time of year plus it isn't raining so I will be outside working most of today.
When I was young I was poor. But after years of hard, honest, and painstaking work I am no longer young.
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Mario.
thanks your a prince.
i'll throw this out there for other pg users.
if you tell me what daw you use then, as long as i can get a trial i will
do tests re 48k and report back.
ie your daw and rb to create a synergy as it were.
with rb serving up tracks to your daw in a 48k environment just like bb does in 44.1k.
let me comment on a few of the many plusses of the your daw and rb working together.
..use of markers will give you visuals so you know eg chorus 3 you can see the
waveform generated in rb that matches your daw.
..varying tempos/fractional tempos might help some people.
..you can use rb as simply as serving up generated tracks to your daw...but as you get more comfortable with the yourdaw/rb linkeage if you go to the rb top menus and the manual youll see many other nifty things you can do with midi and audio tracks.
for example (i am no expert in this) maybe you want to acidise audio.
or maybe lets say you only like bars 44 to 50 that have been genned in rb...
you can just get those bars into your daw. as i said because you can see genned waveforms in rb and with markers it makes the whole process easier.
and there are many other nifty aspects.
ONE PIECE OF ADVICE >>> MAKE SURE YOUR TRACKS STARTING POINT
IS THE SAME IN RB AND YOUR DAW SO YOU DONT HAVE TO ADJUST OR SLIDE TRACKS.
as i said if anyone wants me to test their daw. i will do so...as long as i can get a trial.
once a couple more daws are tested (so far it seems that 3 work ie...reaper,bitwig, mtstudio..)...i'lll post the 48k instructions in pg tips section...( previously detailed in this thread.)
UPDATE.
i know there are some pg users useing audicity. i just tested audacity set to 48k....works !
so now there are 4 daws that work at 48k with rb set to 48k.
happiness and hth.
om
Last edited by justanoldmuso; 10/30/24 11:16 AM.
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om, I just read your instructions and I have a problem. I have never used RB. I have tried but it doesn't fit in to my workflow very easily and since I use a DAW I really don't want to spend the time learning another. If I quickly try RB for this experiment then I might, well actually would, make a mistake and yield incorrect results. BUT if you have stems that you can put in DropBox then I will DL them and load them into Studio One Pro.
When I was young I was poor. But after years of hard, honest, and painstaking work I am no longer young.
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Mario.
dont trouble yourself.
i'll dload s1 and report back.
(actually its just like bb. just import a bb song into rb after setting
rb to 48k in prefs. rb will gen the tracks on import of bb song as set in prefs.
and thats it. then with rb and S1 open just drag rb tracks nos to S1 tracks.
(the cursor will change). so really theres nothing much to learn for a bb user.
but no sweat i'm gonna dload S1 now.
as it saves uploading to dropbox etc.
happiness and respect and happy upcoming xmas.
well i tried to dload the S1 trial and got stuck setting up account.
i cant find a link on presonus to dload trial.
i'll try again once i have time mario. in the interim maybe another S1 user can have a go.
sorry.
om
Last edited by justanoldmuso; 10/30/24 01:15 PM.
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om, I tried to use RB. I saved a RT/RD song in BiaB and tried to load it many times into RB. No luck as all I get is a MIDI drum track and nothing else. RB is so damn frustrating, I know that the problem is with my inexperience with it but I have run many other DAWs with no problems without looking at the docs.
Anyway I set up my audio interface, a Roland Octa-Capture to 48K. Then in BiaB I draged the master to wav and using the DAW mode then dragged and dropped the song into Studio One Pro 7. It played perfectly.
I hope this helps.
When I was young I was poor. But after years of hard, honest, and painstaking work I am no longer young.
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
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Mario.
1..when i save in bb i use save special >>> patches and harmony.
2..IMPORTANT make sure youve done the following in rb.
OPTIONS>>PREFERENCES>>SONG GENERATION and ensure that auto generate is checked. in prefs also PREFS>>AUDIO note audio file type.
set to 48k.
3..now import bb song and tell me do you see waveforms ??
(make sure rb tempo matches bb tempo).
4..then simply go to each genned track number and drag into s1 track.
note also if S1 suppoorts drag/drop not only should you be able to drop rb tracks into S1 but vice versa. ie S1 to rb.
tell me if this works also.
go to stylepicker in rb (right clik over a track in tracks view) pick a demo file in a style. youll see a likkle + by demo...clik it to load in rb the style demo.
you should see style waveforms.
ok i tested another daw bandlab....could a bandlab user confirm something ?
import of the rb genned tracks fine. i set BL to 48k of course but how do i set up
BL so i can drag direct into BL without useing the import feature.
ie does BL support drag/drop rather than import ?
thanks.
happiness.
om
Last edited by justanoldmuso; 10/30/24 04:07 PM.
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As I understand this, BiaB supports 44.1kHz internally and will use a sample-rate convertor if the hardware does not support 44.1kHz. If the hardware supports 44.1kHz, BiaB will change it to that rate. I believe there is no option to choose 48kHz elsewhere than for the final rendering. This is basically correct. ASIO requires locking the sample rate to the program, and as BB operates internally at 44,100hz it will automatically switch the sample rate to 44,100hz. This cannot be changed, however if you use WAS or MME instead (or use RealBand) it is possible to use other sample rates. Keep in mind though that audio recorded into BB will be automatically converted to 44,100hz when you save the file.
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Simon.
thanks for commenting. that clears up lots of things. fantastic.
FYi...ive got rb working great with a number of daws now all set to 48k.
so...a question . CAN WE CONCLUDE THAT TO DO 48 RB IS A GOOD SOLUTION ?? you see what i like is the loads of tracks in rb plus features the bb plugin doesnt have. eg i can see graphically the track and set up markers and do loads of other nifty stuff.
To Bandlab users. ok i figured out BL drag/drop. i set BL as admin.
and drag into the BL browser.
Mario.
see my previous post re setting up rb in prefs re seeing waveforms and setting to 48 k also.
to all...ive used 44.1 for ages...but i might just be a 48k convert now....lol.
so ive set everything to 48k ...interface/daws/win etc etc....and we shall see how things go as i might try some video software at some point.
peace to all and happiness.
om
Last edited by justanoldmuso; 10/30/24 04:27 PM.
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Mario.
(see my previous post re setting up rb preferences.)
ok back to it.
could you send via dropbox your bb file whereby you dont see waveforms in rb ?
so i can test here in rb ? i suspect in your rb preferences song generation that waveforms are turned off. (see my previous post re settings.)
it would be ni9ce to get you going with generating tracks viz 48k so then you could just drop your 48k tracks (your nice soundscapes) into say a video software that likes 48k audio. eg for film or whatever. also this might help new pg users.
to summarise for all.
..useing rb is no different than bb. just gotta make sure in rb preferences you identify the audio device to be used, and set to 48k and ensure auto waveforms is turned on. just like bb you enter chords and generate and then drag the tracks from rb to your fav daw (also set to 48k). one advantage of rb i find is a more flexible generating of tracks environment. its just a question of setting up rb preferences correctly.
and its important to use the same song dir for saveing your work re your daw and rb.
(gotta set in top left of rb the dir via daw options.)
..i have now tested with a number of daws on the market.
(reaper/bitwig/multitrackstudio/bandlab etc.) ...and drag/drop works.
so now you can easily move 48k tracks around tween rb and other daws.
i'll throw this out in good faith anyone pm me if you have problems setting up a 48k environment with rb and your fav daw and/or post pics of your rb settings. and i'll try to help.
to PG please could you consider creating a FAQ re 48k ? or a vid showing how to setup a 48k environment with rb generating tracks and serving them up via drag/drop to a non pg daw ? and most importantly i feel it also needs to include how to set up win audio AND rb preferences and the non pg daw.and the users interface. (here all is set to 48k.). in the interim once i get time shortly i'll post in the tips forum details of how to do the foregoing. (might be usefull for new users.)
obviously this 48k issue crops up occasionally so it would be nice just to point someone to a vid/faq.
well thats it i'm happy to have found a solution re 48k....and as i said rb can be used as a track server upper without the user haveing to learn a lot about rb.
just gotta set up rb preferences correctly...which one has to do in any daw.
happiness to all.
om
ps mario send me via drop box that bb sgu whereby waveforms arent generated in rb.
Last edited by justanoldmuso; 10/31/24 03:15 AM.
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As I understand this, BiaB supports 44.1kHz internally and will use a sample-rate convertor if the hardware does not support 44.1kHz. If the hardware supports 44.1kHz, BiaB will change it to that rate. I believe there is no option to choose 48kHz elsewhere than for the final rendering. This is basically correct. ASIO requires locking the sample rate to the program, and as BB operates internally at 44,100hz it will automatically switch the sample rate to 44,100hz. This cannot be changed, however if you use WAS or MME instead (or use RealBand) it is possible to use other sample rates. Keep in mind though that audio recorded into BB will be automatically converted to 44,100hz when you save the file. As BiaB seems to work only at 44.1kHz, I imagine the recorded-audio conversion is done at record time, rather than save time. Why/how are WAS and MME different from ASIO in regards of sampling rate, please? Is the resampling done within the driver/API, rather than by BiaB?
Jazz relative beginner, starting at a much older age than was helpful.
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CAN WE CONCLUDE THAT TO DO 48 RB IS A GOOD SOLUTION ?? Yes. As BiaB seems to work only at 44.1kHz, I imagine the recorded-audio conversion is done at record time, rather than save time. I believe so. Why/how are WAS and MME different from ASIO in regards of sampling rate, please? Is the resampling done within the driver/API, rather than by BiaB? I'm not certain, but I believe the resampling is always done at the driver level. Resampling is only necessary when using a shared sound device, as applications might send audio at different rates (and certainly not synchronized). ASIO was never designed to be a shared device, as it was intended that the output of an application would be routed directly to the interface bypassing the Windows audio systems. Any audio device that supports multiple clients using ASIO is essentially using a hack of sorts to make that work (I believe those essentially set up invisible virtual inputs to a software mixer, but I'm not sure). Either way, since ASIO applications expect to be locked to the device, ASIO doesn't do resampling - this is why BB changes the interface sample rate when using ASIO, otherwise it would either not work at all, play back at a different pitch/speed, or destroy your ears with horrible digital noise.
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thanks Simon. your clarifications are very very appreciated. All. note...in pg tips section i have gone into lots of detail re doing a 48k song project useing ones favorite daw and rb together to realise a nice solution..rb to generate tracks which are then dragged into the users fav daw. it includes various details re set up etc etc. its really quite simple once things are set up. and itemises how to use rb simply without a big learning cycle. bottom line is if a user has used biab it should be a doddle. here is the link to the tips... https://www.pgmusic.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=827109#Post827109i sincerely hope that this helps people doing 48k song projects. as i said in tips if someone encounters any problems just post the projects pg song file on dropbox so us rb users can run tests. also it would be usefull to post pics of your rb preferences/settings etc. simon once again thanks for your comments. might i suggest a pg faq plus video addressing the 48k issue ? as i'm sure it will come up often....i would do a vid but i'm lousy at such and also there is the issue of my vision impairment. fyi i have gone all 48k now i have got it working the way i want. happiness. om
Last edited by justanoldmuso; 10/31/24 04:59 PM.
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Thanks to Simon and all of the BiaB users who contributed to this conversation. I had ZERO idea that the question I asked would result in this incredible amount of information. The simple solution for me was changing BiaB to WAS.
Thanks again, everyone, and happy All Saints' Day. It's a holiday here in France, so of course the main shopping district, starting 50 meters from my apartment is closed to car traffic and hosting a braderie (sidewalk sale) this weekend. It'll be a human zoo.
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So pleased that this is sorted out for you. Profitez de votre fête de la Toussaint. Laissez la musique de côté un instant et participez aux célébrations 
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Mario.
(see my previous post re setting up rb preferences.)
ok back to it.
could you send via dropbox your bb file whereby you dont see waveforms in rb ?
so i can test here in rb ? i suspect in your rb preferences song generation that waveforms are turned off. (see my previous post re settings.)
it would be ni9ce to get you going with generating tracks viz 48k so then you could just drop your 48k tracks (your nice soundscapes) into say a video software that likes 48k audio. eg for film or whatever. also this might help new pg users.
.................................................... Hi om, I was tied up all of yesterday so I didn't see this until today. I'm sorry I had deleted that sgu right after my attempts failed. Since this topic has been resolved do you still want me to continue? If so I can try again tomorrow; again I will not be around today to spend any extended time on my computer.
When I was young I was poor. But after years of hard, honest, and painstaking work I am no longer young.
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Mario.
your a prince...yeah i wouldnt mind trying a sgu that failed for you but i dont want to trouble you. the reason being if i find out why the sgu isnt working for you then i can update the 48k tips ive posted in pg tips section to help others who might encounter same prob.
as you know my fun is beating tech problems....lol.
i assume your not seeing waveforms displayed in rb tracks view ??
so also if possible i would also like a pic of your rb preferences..so i can see settings for song generation and also drivers. that would help me diagnose.
as i said i have posted in pg tips forum in detail how to do a all 48k project includeing settings that works for me.
i'm all 48k now. the tips section has all the details. essentially rb like bb is only being used to gen tracks which are then dragged into the persons main daw so rb learning cycle is kept to an absolute minimum. just rb preferences have to be set up.
and i hope will help people doing audio for picture for example.
the latest daw ive tested with is bandlab.
see tips section for further info.
just so people understand i'm not anti bb (ive used it for yonks...) i also have been trying to find a solution re bb 48k work. but as simon clarified it seems bb likes 44.1.
one thing i want to test out today is IF bb is set to a wasapi driver instead of asio when one exports from bb the generated tracks are they 44.1 OR 48k....i suspect 44.1.
gonna do more testing today.
the other likkle 'wrinkle' with useing wasapi...is the issue of recording tasks.
asio has much lower latency than wasapi....here i'm 4ms latency at 128 samples useing asio.
so one possible problem useing wasapi in bb is...the following scenario....
often in bb i like to layout a 'ruff guide vocal' to see how things knit together with the genned bb tracks. but if useing wasapi how much latency will be introduced doing guides particularly if useing an old clunky pc or an unoptimised for music production pc. bottom line if people wanna do guide vocs etc... due to wasapi latency will they have to shift a track forward in time like in days of yore.
happiness and respect.
om
Last edited by justanoldmuso; 11/01/24 05:39 AM.
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om, in all honesty the 48k does not impact me as it does others. I bring BiaB MIDI data into Studio One Pro 7, i.e. no audio files are involved. Thus I can set my DAW to 48k, choose what sounds I want to the MIDI data tracks, and all will be 48k. Thanx to you and others in this thread right after I finish my current song I am going to use 48k from now on. Thanx everyone.
When I was young I was poor. But after years of hard, honest, and painstaking work I am no longer young.
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
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So pleased that this is sorted out for you. Profitez de votre fête de la Toussaint. Laissez la musique de côté un instant et participez aux célébrations Merci ! C'est ce que j'ai fait. J'ai emmené mes 3 chiens faire une promenade d'une heure le long de la plage.
Last edited by TheMaartian; 11/01/24 06:04 AM.
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Bitwig Studio 5; Studio One Pro 7; Melodyne Studio 5; Acoustica Premium 7
Gig Performer 5; NI S61 MK3; Focal Shape 65; Beyerdynamic DT 880 & 770
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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All.
ok please be aware of the following.
i just ran a test bb set to wasapi and sound interface set to 48k.
then i exported via drag a track and it was 44.1 not 48k.
whereas when i generate in rb and export its 48k from my testing.
this would seem to confirm what simon said.
simon tell me if i'm wrong.
mario is right it doesnt affect all midi projects. but audio is different of course.
anyhoo ive done all i can...happiness to all.
it was an interesting thread.
om
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Three pages, yieps!! Hard to tell exactly if the question was ever actually answered? Please don't try to tell me how to do it. Just give me a simple Yes or No - can BIAB be set to 48K?
Final Tour - Not with a Bang but with a wimper!
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DRdan.
i just answered in my last post.
according to my tests bb exports in 44.1k....even tho set to 48k.
see simons post a few posts back.
if you want true export to 48k then rb is the tool.
(see my tips in tips section.)
om
Last edited by justanoldmuso; 11/01/24 06:28 AM.
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Three pages, yieps!! Hard to tell exactly if the question was ever actually answered? Please don't try to tell me how to do it. Just give me a simple Yes or No - can BIAB be set to 48K? Sadly it can't be quite that simple. I think the following is an accurate summary. Hopefully if I'm wrong Simon will jump in and say so.
BiaB does not operate at 48kHz, it operates at 44.1kHz.
It will resample to audio files, it will co-operate with 48kHz devices if WAS or MME are used, but not resample if ASIO is used unless the ASIO does not support 44.1kHz, then it also resamples to match the device.Assuming my statements above are accurate, perhaps they could be pinned or added to the FAQ section. Edit: I think JOM's posts appear to suggest that drag-and-drop may also not resample. I haven't tried to prove or disprove that ... an official statement would be good.
Last edited by Gordon Scott; 11/01/24 08:20 AM.
Jazz relative beginner, starting at a much older age than was helpful.
AVL:MXE Linux; Windows 11
BIAB2024 Audiophile, a bunch of other software.
Kawai MP6, Ui24R, Focusrite Saffire Pro40 and Scarletts
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Thanks to Simon and all of the BiaB users who contributed to this conversation. I had ZERO idea that the question I asked would result in this incredible amount of information. The simple solution for me was changing BiaB to WAS.
Thanks again, everyone, and happy All Saints' Day. It's a holiday here in France, so of course the main shopping district, starting 50 meters from my apartment is closed to car traffic and hosting a braderie (sidewalk sale) this weekend. It'll be a human zoo. Just in case you were worrying, you didn't cause a storm of posts with a simple question. The storm was always there because of the sample-rate issue, both with audio devices and also with people wanting to work with other sample rates, e.g., 48kHz, 96kHz and so on. I think it's safe to say that this issue has been around for quite a while and has long been a nuisance.
Jazz relative beginner, starting at a much older age than was helpful.
AVL:MXE Linux; Windows 11
BIAB2024 Audiophile, a bunch of other software.
Kawai MP6, Ui24R, Focusrite Saffire Pro40 and Scarletts
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i forgot to mention....testing sample rate of a audio file.
to cut through everything just use a feature in some music apps to measure sample rate in an imported file irrespective of what that music app sampling rate is set to.
eg audacity OR upload the audio file to a net site that reports sample rate. (google.).
eg drag a genned audio file from bb to a test dir in windows explorer and then upload to the web sampling rate test site and/or drag into audacity.
(the feature is hidden a bit in audacity...after importing youll see the track and on left hand side some dots.... click those to see sampling rate of imported file.)
Dan or anyone else...just follow above procedure.
it takes little time.
om
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Yet again a RealBand hijacking.
Cheers
rayc
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To the O/P: RealBand can do somethings that Band-In-A-Box cannot. I don't use Reaper or other similar products, but they can also probably do things that Band-In-A-Box cannot. Thanks to the other contributors for offering alternative solutions when Band-In-A-Box cannot deliver the required outcome. Knowing about alternatives can be very helpful in these situations. That's the great thing about sharing information and experiences in these forums. Good job 
BIAB & RB2024 Win.(Audiophile), Sonar Platinum, Cakewalk by Bandlab, Izotope Prod.Bundle, Roland RD-1000, Synthogy Ivory, Kontakt, Focusrite 18i20, KetronSD2, NS40M Monitors, Pioneer Active Monitors, AKG K271 Studio H'phones
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OP
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To the O/P: RealBand can do somethings that Band-In-A-Box cannot. I don't use Reaper or other similar products, but they can also probably do things that Band-In-A-Box cannot. Thanks to the other contributors for offering alternative solutions when Band-In-A-Box cannot deliver the required outcome. Knowing about alternatives can be very helpful in these situations. That's the great thing about sharing information and experiences in these forums. Good job ^^^ +1 I no longer install RealBand since I never used it. I've even uninstalled Reaper after a decade of use. Bitwig Studio and Studio One Pro are more than enough for this amateur home studio geezer. 
ThinkPad i9 32GB RAM 7TB SSD; Win11 Pro; RME Fireface UCX II; BiaB 2024 Ultra
Bitwig Studio 5; Studio One Pro 7; Melodyne Studio 5; Acoustica Premium 7
Gig Performer 5; NI S61 MK3; Focal Shape 65; Beyerdynamic DT 880 & 770
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Special Pricing! Until September 30, 2024, all the Xtra Styles PAKs 1 - 18 are on sale for only $29 ea (Reg. $49 ea)! Expand your Band-in-a-Box 2024® library with Xtra Styles PAK 18! Order now!
Learn more and listen to demos of the Xtra Styles PAK 18 here.
Watch the Xtra Styles PAK 18 Overview & Styles Demos video.
Note: The Xtra Styles require the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box®. (Xtra Styles PAK 18 requires the 2024 UltraPAK/UltraPAK+/Audiophile Edition. They will not work with the Pro or MegaPAK version because they need the RealTracks from the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition.
New! Xtra Styles PAK 18 for Band-in-a-Box 2024 for Windows!
Xtra Styles PAK 18 for Band-in-a-Box version 2024 is here with 200 brand new styles to take for a spin!
Along with 50 new styles each for the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres, we’ve put together a collection of styles using sounds from the SynthMaster plugin!
In this PAK you'll find: dubby reggae grooves, rootsy Americana, LA jazz pop, driving pop rock, mellow electronica, modern jazz fusion, spacey country ballads, Motown shuffles, energetic EDM, and plenty of synth heavy grooves! Xtra Style PAK 18 features these styles and many, many more!
Special Pricing! Until September 30, 2024, all the Xtra Styles PAKs 1 - 18 are on sale for only $29 ea (Reg. $49 ea)! Expand your Band-in-a-Box 2024® library with Xtra Styles PAK 18! Order now!
Learn more and listen to demos of the Xtra Styles PAK 18 here.
Watch the Xtra Styles PAK 18 Overview & Styles Demos video.
Note: The Xtra Styles require the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box®. (Xtra Styles PAK 18 requires the 2024 UltraPAK/UltraPAK+/Audiophile Edition. They will not work with the Pro or MegaPAK version because they need the RealTracks from the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition.
New! XPro Styles PAK 7 for Band-in-a-Box 2024 for Windows!
We've just released XPro Styles PAK 7 with 100 brand new RealStyles, plus 50 RealTracks and RealDrums that are sure to delight!
With XPro Styles PAK 7 you can expect 25 rock & pop, 25 jazz, and 25 country styles, as well as 25 of this year's wildcard genre: Celtic!
Here's a small sampling of what XPro Styles PAK 7 has to offer: energetic rock jigs, New Orleans funk, lilting jazz waltzes, fast Celtic punk, uptempo train beats, gritty grunge, intense jazz rock, groovy EDM, soulful R&B, soft singer-songwriter pop, country blues rock, and many more!
Special Pricing! Until September 30, 2024, all the XPro Styles PAKs 1 - 7 are on sale for only $29 ea (Reg. $49 ea)! Supercharge your Band-in-a-Box 2024® with XPro Styles PAK 7! Order now!
Learn more and listen to demos of XPro Styles PAKs.
Watch the XPro Styles PAK 7 Overview & Styles Demos video.
XPro Styles PAKs require Band-in-a-Box® 2024 or higher and are compatible with ANY package, including the Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, and Audiophile Edition.
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