PG Music Home Forums General Discussion Help! Tech S.O.S (Off topic) Studio One Randomly Freezes [Resolved]

Anyone else having freeze-up problems?

I have version 7.02 on Win 11 and out of the blue and randomly it freezes and won't play an audio file of a song I'm trying to learn. So the workspace is as simple as it gets with just an MP3 file dragged in. The mouse cursor changes to the circular activity icon and although I can execute commands from the menus, there is a long delay (a second or two) between clicking the item and it executing that item.

I'm thinking it may be related to it "phoning home". The last time it ocurred I popped over to my email tool and it took a few seconds to refresh it. But after refreshing I went back to S1 and it hadn't regained it's mind. It's as if whatever anomaly ocurred causes it to latch into an unresponsive state.

While in this unresponsive state, the Task Manager tells me that S1 is using between zero and 1% CPU.

Hmmm. Well, Presonus closed all of their forums(!!) a few weeks ago. Subsequently, a user community has started up here.

A quick scan only found some information about 13th and 14th generation Intel processors needing a BIOS update to prevent crashing.

A deeper look at the forum posts may be warranted, assuming you haven't already.

Know these can be frustrating, hope it resolves soonest. Good luck!

I have Studio One Pro 7.02 with Windows 11. I was playing around today with a song I am working on, but I have not come across anything wrong. I am also connected to the internet as well and there is no delay with my email.

I haven’t seen this.

My first thought reading your post was something running in the background, but that’s not it if your CPU usage stays that low.

The only thing I’ve read that comes closest is that it’s a malfunctioning plugin. Do you have any trial - unregistered plugins?

I have had Studio One 5 Pro freeze a couple of times, and that seemed to be related to plugins. I just downloaded 7 and have had no issues after using it ten or fifteen times.

The crashes were few and far between. Sonar used to crash once in a while.

As I remember some of these issues came shortly after a Windows update.

I have never come up with a solid reason. It has happened only perhaps three or four times in my total history with Studio One.

Only once did a crash occur when I was about thirty tracks into something. That taught me a lesson and I now save frequently.
None of my standalone music software like Toontracks or Guitar Rig Pro has ever crashed. Well, BIAB has crashed once or twice over the years.

I do not ever remember having any sort of crash soon after cleaning up my drives and getting rid of junk.

I assume doing good housekeeping helps to reduce these issues. I use third-party software to scan the register which has worked well for me.

My best guess is plugins/software. I have at least 400 gigs of NI/Toontracks/Melodyne/ AutoTune and other assorted software.

None of this may be related to your issue thumper. I don't have a rocket ship but i9-9900 3.60 32 gigs RAM good SSD water cooling ect, so I don't think any crashes I have had are due to inadequate system hardware.

I would go look at your event log and also do some housekeeping and see if that helps. I have had pretty good luck with CleanMyPC. (chkdsk c:) if I remember correctly( f switch to auto fix) Do a disk check at the command line. Take a good look at the physical USB connections. They sometimes get worn if you use them a lot and can cause a disconnect and reconnect. With the machine off/unpluged move them in and out to remove oxidation on the contacts.
The chkdsk Command should return something like this



C:\Windows\System32>chkdsk c:
The type of the file system is NTFS.
Volume label is DISK 2 970 EVO.

WARNING! /F parameter not specified.
Running CHKDSK in read-only mode.

Stage 1: Examining basic file system structure ...
1005824 file records processed.
File verification completed.
Phase duration (File record verification): 5.58 seconds.
33478 large file records processed.
Phase duration (Orphan file record recovery): 14.88 milliseconds.
0 bad file records processed.
Phase duration (Bad file record checking): 0.15 milliseconds.

Stage 2: Examining file name linkage ...
3052 reparse records processed.
1384476 index entries processed.
Index verification completed.
Phase duration (Index verification): 17.39 seconds.
0 unindexed files scanned.
Phase duration (Orphan reconnection): 1.28 seconds.
0 unindexed files recovered to lost and found.
Phase duration (Orphan recovery to lost and found): 0.18 milliseconds.
3052 reparse records processed.
Phase duration (Reparse point and Object ID verification): 10.58 milliseconds.

Stage 3: Examining security descriptors ...
Security descriptor verification completed.
Phase duration (Security descriptor verification): 283.07 milliseconds.
189327 data files processed.
Phase duration (Data attribute verification): 0.95 milliseconds.
CHKDSK is verifying Usn Journal...
36820408 USN bytes processed.
Usn Journal verification completed.
Phase duration (USN journal verification): 82.53 milliseconds.

Windows has scanned the file system and found no problems.
No further action is required.

972383283 KB total disk space.
838133440 KB in 491202 files.
435888 KB in 189328 indexes.
0 KB in bad sectors.
1366571 KB in use by the system.
65536 KB occupied by the log file.
132447384 KB available on disk.

4096 bytes in each allocation unit.
243095820 total allocation units on disk.
33111846 allocation units available on disk.
Total duration: 24.66 seconds (24665 ms).

C:\Windows\System32>

The event viewer is a pretty deep rabbit hole. I have a CCIE friend to get to log on to my machine if I have real problems.

Happy Holidays,

Billy

Thanks to all that have replied.

Ron, The first thing I did was go out to the Presonus forum and it looked like the last post was from Aug; very strange. And now you confirm that they shut down their forum. What are they thinking??? Could this be my first real disappointment with Presonus?

But now after restarting my computer I'm getting a sample rate mismatch error message. Upon investigation I see that somehow the setting for the digital interface got changed from my Tascam to Realtek. I have no idea how this got changed. I certainly didn't change it. And I only got the sample rate error message this morning but my problem has existed for a few days. Thinking about this, it seems to make sense why no audio would play at all but that I did have very sluggish command response. I changed it back to my Tascam and things [so far] are working properly.

Brian, yeah, my issue is/was sporadic.

Matt, I have no trial plugins. Actually, as far as plugins go, I'm fairly "clean" with just 2 installed; Scaler and Ascension; neither of which were active in my workspace.

Billy, I haven't had time to read your post but I will.

So far, my system seems to be running stable but I am curious as to why and how the setting for my interface got changed and why it took S1 so long to give me a sample rate error. Maybe the root cause was a Windows update that somehow changed the setting.

As I continue to learn a new bass line later today, I'll be looping sections of that audio file which will further test its stability.

Hey Billy,
You provided quite a trove of info. Much appreciated.
Lo and behold I discovered "Event 1002" associated with S1.
My theory is that during the 7.0.2 upgrade, somehow my digital interface setting reverted to the default Realtek and that's what messed me up.

Now with my engineering hat on (us enginers maye nut be uble to spel but ulways loking to impruve thungs ) I'm thinking Microsoft should design a small, local and smart application that would monitor and digest the Event Log records and provide actionable info like:

"Steve, based on your recent download of Studio One 7.0.2, Event 1002 ocurred. System instability is expected and you should verify that your audio interface settings in Studio One are still valid."

To Microsoft: I'm available part time to provide consultation . . . but full disclosure, I'm mighty expensive.
To Presonus: Please restore your online forum ASAP.
To Billy: Happy Holidays to you too man and happy event logging.

BH.

when all is working well best to take pics of...

..win audio settings for rec and playback and advanced tab also.
..interface settings
..music apps driver settings eg bb or rb or another daw app.

less hassle that way.
(see my tips in tips forum...might be usefull.)

hth/merry x.

om

As far as utility programs go I used to use CC Cleaner for a long time but Microsoft now has its own tool called PC Manager that is free and does a fine job.
Microsoft PC Manager

Steve, I have had Window updates as well as Nvidia updates change my audio interface settings. Windows to Realtek and Nvidia to their audio. It can be a PITA. However just to be safe I would do a full anti-virus and a anti-malware scan.

Update and possible root cause.

My Studio One problem still exists and a thought came to me, could Guitar Pro be the problem. So I shut down GP and lo and behold, the circular activity mouse icon in Studio One changed back to the normal pointer and full functionality returned.

So then I queried my AI assistant and it gave me this.
Yes, Guitar Pro can sometimes cause issues with other programs that use the same digital interface. Users have reported that when Guitar Pro is open, it can interfere with other applications that use the audio driver, such as Skype, Zoom, or even YouTube. This is often due to how Guitar Pro handles audio drivers and its interaction with the system's sound settings.
Here are a few tips to mitigate these issues:
1. Use ASIO Drivers: If you're not already using ASIO drivers, consider installing them. ASIO4ALL is a popular choice that can help manage audio routing more effectively.
2. Check Audio Settings: In Guitar Pro, go to the "Audio/MIDI Devices" settings and ensure the device is set to "Standard" instead of "ASIO" if you're experiencing conflicts.
3. Virtual Audio Cable: Using a virtual audio cable program can help with routing audio between different applications.
4. Consistent Sample Rates: Ensure that all your audio applications are set to the same sample rate to avoid conflicts.
These steps should help you manage any potential conflicts between Guitar Pro and other programs using the same digital interface.

Item 2 may be relevant because that setting in GP is set to "ASIO" but I'm planning to change it to "Standard" as it suggests.

I'm not claiming victory quite yet, but I think I'm getting close. Either way, hopefully this thread will be of use to someone else in the future.

And holey mackrel! The more advanced technology becomes, the more advanced the problems!

AI diagnosed that? I need to pay more attention.

Let's hope the AI is correct. This is one of the really useful functions that AI could provide.

I have asked questions like that and it has returned plausible nonsense. But, it is also correct at other times.

Let us know if AI is on the right track.

Billy

Matt and Billy,
Yeah, on the one hand I'm quite impressed with what AI can produce, but on the other hand, if you or I had first hand and instant access to the TBs of info on the internet then we too could produce answers like it can. At sometime, a number of GP users complained on some message board that it can interfere with other software that uses the same digital interface. The LLM I'm using simply was trained on that scraped info.

A few weeks ago I saw a plot in a technical paper that showed how the gap between all the info the internet has (and will have) and the amount of info that LLMs have been trained on is rapidly narrowing. And for reasons I don't yet understand, computer scientists are concerned that they are running out of new training data.

Keep in mind, ChatGPT is not even 5 years old yet.

I say having no more new training data is a good thing because the LLM is complete. And completeness is good, but there must be more to the story.

BT.

whats your interface ??

are you running multi client asio drivers ?

see my multi client sound/interfaces that are MC... tips thread in tips forum for more info.
might be usefull.

merry x.

om

Studio One does have a "Release Audio Device In Background" checkbox. You might want to have a play around with that setting. Also do the sample rates of both programs match?
Also no matter which interface you're using, temporarily change to "Windows Audio", open the "Control Panel" and UN-check the "Exclusive Mode" check box.
Change your settings back to your interface and in most cases it will allow other apps to use the interface while S1 is open and/or playing audio.

I don't know if this will fix your issue but might be worth a try.

Good idea Brian. I remember that Studio One gives advice on that setting. I don’t remember now what it is, because I set it once and haven’t looked again. In years past, SONAR did the same thing

JAOM, I have a Tascam Series 208i that has served me well for years.

As for the tips forum, I don't know where that is located. You didn't supply a link.

And please take no offence, but if it lacks proper punctuation and capitalization, I can't read it.
Such writing litterally gives me a head ache after the 3rd sentence.

That said, I do believe I've reached a solution, with GP as the culprit.
A few more days of Studio One usage should tell me yes or no.

BT.

if your tascam is old i suspect its not multi client.

i'm surprised youve never seen the pg tips forum...

heres the pg tips forum...loads of neat tips from lots of pg users.

https://www.pgmusic.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=postlist&Board=31&page=1

and heres the usb interface/multi client thread...
lots of views so obviously some people read it.

https://www.pgmusic.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=718708#Post718708

for example my audient usb interface is multi client asio.
see the thread for more info about multi client and pg users that use it.

if in doubt if an interface is multi client asio contact the manufacturer..
ie in this case tascam.

ps...lol...pg tips is a tea brand in uk.
om

I’m not sure exactly what you mean by “multi-client”. The website or user manual doesn’t seem to specifically mention “multi-client”.

But this little guy has all the ins and outs I need and can seamlessly move from playing a YouTube on headphones, to recording my instruments in Studio One while playing a backing track, to playing a Guitar Pro or BiaB file, to playing an audio file via a media player, to playing my keyboard thru monitor 1 while playing a backing track thru monitor 2. In short, this interface has handled virtually every audio task I’ve thrown at it. It can even receive a mic for recording. It’s a serious piece of gear and still available for purchase.

But like I say, Guitar Pro appears to be the root cause of my problem, not the interface.

Normally ASIO drivers only support one audio interface at a time. Multi client is a special wrapper that allows another device to access it. You can do a search for Multi client ASIO driver and it will give you the technical information about how this works. I don't think I am giving you the exact details of how this works.

Hi Steve,

If your Guitar Pro is using ASIO drivers AND Studio One Pro is also using ASIO problems you will experience crashes. This is what Brian was referring. Most ASIO drivers will only work with one program at a time. A Multi-Client ASIO driver will run more than one program at a time.

If I have BiaB and ST1 both using ASIO drivers I will get a crash, thus I always have BiaB using MME drivers, i.e. no crashes.

Thanks Mario that is exactly what I was trying to say!

Thanks for trying to help Mario,
Did you see what my AI bot already came up with?

After I discovered that the S1 problem went away when GP isn't running I then followed what the bot said and the problem is still gone even when GP is running.

You and it may be partially saying the same thing. It is specifically saying to use "Standard" in GP, you are saying don't use ASIO if Studio One is using ASIO.

You say I'll experience crashes if S1 is using ASIO. The problem with that is in my configuration there is no ASIO option available in S1!
S1 recognizes the Tascam, and so Series 102i/208i shows up as an option. From day 1, this setting has been set and I've had no problem until GP appeared.

All this continues to point to GP as being the root cause and the solution is to set "Standard" in GP. I think I experienced a driver clash.

You say "A Multi-Client ASIO driver will run more than one program at a time." OK, I am now running more than one program at a time. Which is Multi-Client? The "Standard" in GP of the "Series 102i/208i" in S1?

I'm guessing that over the years there must have been hundreds of people that have had driver issues (like the one I just solved) or different issues. I'm sure some of these folks simply gave up and accepted defeat. I see in S1 that there is also an option to release audio device in background. Other audio programs will have their own set of settings and options. And I'm not convinced that the various manufacturers are even talking amoung themselves in this regard.

I scanned the "tips" post that om referred to and it is no different that an ordinary post; lots of different people offering perspectives sprinkled with YouTube vids. To be sure there is some "wheat" in that tip thread but there is also a lot of "chaff" to work thru.

This tells me we have another need for a well-written paper on all things related to programs that use audio and how to prevent conflicts when multiple such programs are used at the same time. Or maybe somebody has already written it.

Steve, yes there is an ASIO setting in ST1, see pics.
Yes AI, Brain, and I are saying the same thing. In ST1 if no ASIO is available, that is GP is in ASIO, it will not show during start up. But if ST1 is set to ASIO then you boot GP and it is set to ASIO then you will get a crash. If I were in your shoes I would permanently set GP to either MME or WAS and set ST1 permanently to ASIO.

Your Tascam is not multi-client. A multi-client ASIO driver will run two or more ASIO driver programs simultaneously. All audio interfaces will run ASIO and MME or ASIO and WAS simultaneously.

I have no idea what standard is.

I would like to add to what Mario just said. You mentioned this earlier in your post:

"But now after restarting my computer I'm getting a sample rate mismatch error message. Upon investigation I see that somehow the setting for the digital interface got changed from my Tascam to Realtek. I have no idea how this got changed. I certainly didn't change it. And I only got the sample rate error message this morning but my problem has existed for a few days. Thinking about this, it seems to make sense why no audio would play at all but that I did have very sluggish command response. I changed it back to my Tascam and things [so far] are working properly."

Windows 11 set my internal soundcard sample rate to 48khz and I usually always work in 44khz 24 bit as I don't do video. I would get that error message as well when I would start up BIAB. Just a thought of why you might of been getting that message?

Mario, I’m curious what info source is telling you that the Tascam 208i is not multi-client? I’m observing the opposite.

According to AI:
Yes, the Tascam 208i is a multi-client audio interface. This means it can handle multiple audio streams from different applications simultaneously, allowing you to run several audio programs at the same time without conflicts.

When I say the Tascam 208i is a multi-client audio interface, it means that the interface and its driver software are designed to handle multiple audio streams from different applications simultaneously. Here's a breakdown:
1. Hardware: The Tascam 208i hardware is capable of managing multiple inputs and outputs, which is essential for multi-client functionality.
2. Driver Software: The driver software provided by Tascam for the 208i supports multi-client operation. This means that the driver can handle audio streams from multiple applications at the same time without conflicts.
In essence, both the hardware and the driver software work together to provide multi-client capabilities, allowing you to run several audio programs simultaneously and route audio efficiently.

Tascam designed their own custom driver software for the Tascam 208i. The driver software is specifically tailored to ensure high stability and reliable performance for their audio interfaces. This custom driver allows the Tascam 208i to handle multiple audio streams from different applications simultaneously, providing multi-client capabilities.

Tascam's custom driver software for the Tascam 208i is called the TASCAM Control Panel. This software is designed to manage the interface's settings and provide stable operation with low latency.

A popular audio interface that is not multi-client is the Focusrite Scarlett series. While these interfaces are highly regarded for their sound quality and reliability, they do not support multi-client operation. This means that only one application can use the audio interface at a time, which can be a limitation for users who need to run multiple audio programs simultaneously.

According to Tascam Tech support: He said he wasn’t familiar with the term “multi-client” but he said the 208i will smoothly handle any number of audio applications that are running as long as those applications do not have “exclusive control”.

According to my gear advisor: All 3rd and 4th generation Focusrite interfaces are multi-client. He had no experience with the 208i.

According to the Guitar Pro User Guide : Choose among the plugged devices. We strongly recommend using an ASIO device on Windows. The ASIO drivers are vital to use the Line-In functionality in Guitar Pro, and to get the best out of the application in general. On macOS, the CoreAudio drivers are used. ASIO (Audio Stream Input/Output), developed by Steinberg, is a cross-platform, multi-channel audio transfer protocol that is being adopted by many of the manufacturers of audio/MIDI sequencing applications. It allows software to have access to the multi-channel capabilities of a wide range of powerful sound cards.

According to me: Attached is an overview diagram of my configuration, I should have built this diagram years ago to organize my info. All the music software shown (with proper settings) can be running at the same time. When Guitar Pro had incorrect settings Studio One had a problem. But the Tascam could seamlessly move from one program to the next. In the case of Guitar Pro, I think its device got incorrectly changed by a software glitch during an upgrade.
If anyone wants such a diagram of their rig, send me a PM.

Steve ALL audio interfaces are multi-client as they can simultaneously take audio from ASIO and MME or ASIO and WAS. Being ASIO multi-client means it can take audio from more than one ASIO source, which I believe the 208i can not.

Nowhere in the Tascam site does it say that the 208i is ASIO multi-client. If it was I believe it would be highlighted:
https://tascam.com/us/product/series_208i/support

If you can show me wrong then I will apologize.

I'm more confused than ever.
First you say my Tascam is not multi-client.
Then you say ALL audio interfaces are multi-client.

Multi-client and ASIO multi-client are two totally different things.
Today most all companies call ASIO multi-client units as multi-client. None use multi-client for ASIO and MME/WAS. Your AI was calling ASIO and MME/WAS multi-client which is technologically correct but not used in today's terminology.

Mario,
1. I hear with my own ears that the Tascam can handle multiple audio streams from different applications running simultaneously. I trust my ears.

2. The Tascam guy tells me the 208i will smoothly handle any number of audio applications that are running as long as those applications do not have “exclusive control”. I trust this expert.

3. The AI is telling me the 208i can handle multiple audio streams. I trust the AI.

Do you realize that all 3 agree?

On the other hand, you are telling me that the Tacam is not multi-client. I don’t trust that. Do you even own one? Once again, what is the source of your information to back that claim?

You then say that ALL interfaces are multi-client. I don’t trust that. First, that is in direct conflict with your earlier statement. And, “ALL” is a very big word. Have you tested ALL interfaces? Once again, what is the source of your information to back that claim?

If you can’t provide sources for your information, I think we should end this discussion. This is going nowhere. With all due respect, you sound very confused.

Mario, I know the reality of this interface; I use it daily. And I’m telling you it can handle multiple audio streams with no problem.

The post that squares best with my understanding is this one by Mario:

“If your Guitar Pro is using ASIO drivers AND Studio One Pro is also using ASIO problems you will experience crashes. This is what Brian was referring. Most ASIO drivers will only work with one program at a time. A Multi-Client ASIO driver will run more than one program at a time.

If I have BiaB and ST1 both using ASIO drivers I will get a crash, thus I always have BiaB using MME drivers, i.e. no crashes.”

The posts that talk about Multi-client ASIO are not relevant to BIAB, where you can use the MME or WAS driver, leaving ASIO to your DAW for recording. Since the ASIO driver you should use is the one provided by the manufacturer, then you can choose equipment that has a multiclient ASIO driver only if you must use two ASIO driver devices at the same time. You are correct to uncheck any setting that takes exclusive use of a device.

RE MULTI CLIENT.

heres what i understand to be re a usb interface being TRUE ASIO MULTI CLIENT.
(mario is correct.)

"various apps can be run concurrently at ultra low latency (eg 4ms ) useing asio drivers.'

WHEREAS...

if the user is only allowed to have one app running at a time at ultra low latency (eg 4ms) and the user must resort to haveing other apps running useing higher latency drivers (eg was or mme) then the interface doesnt have obviously true asio multi client driver support.
in summary not true MC if only one app can run at a time at ultra low latency.

capiche ?...lol.

heres more info and user comments re sound devices...
as well as a definition from sweetwater.com.

https://www.pgmusic.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=718708#Post718708


merry x.

om

Mario, please don’t take this the wrong way; this is friend to friend.

If you feel you’re experiencing brain fog or sporadic lapses of short-term memory, do seek medical help. It may be as simple as your meds interacting.

You can’t say my Tacam “is not multi-client” and then immediately say “ALL interfaces are multi-client”. That’s just detached from reality on so many levels.

Again, this is friend to friend.

I don’t think that’s what Mario said. Regardless, let it go. This borders on a personal attack which is not allowed in the forum rules.