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These are impressive layouts. Thanks. I hope that PGM staff are noticing.
BIAB & RB2025 Win.(Audiophile), Sonar Platinum, Cakewalk by Bandlab, Izotope Prod.Bundle, Roland RD-1000, Synthogy Ivory, Kontakt, Focusrite 18i20, KetronSD2, NS40M Monitors, Pioneer Active Monitors, AKG K271 Studio H'phones
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That's so good, so professional what you have done, you have obviously gone to a lot of trouble. I don't know if you could do all that in the old Delphi as it seems to be just old grey dialog boxes/windows with check boxes and standard buttons. I think that would be a lot easier with JUCE UI programming as Adar seems to implement things in the Plugin UI quickly and with professionalism and quality. I think PG is a a pivotal moment where it needs to take some big steps for a whole new audience, maybe keep an old legacy version for the old users and a quantum leap version for new users that is crossplatform OS Standalone/VST with one click > compile It's just so good to see users with insights and ideas to take it a leap forward where it belongs as we all love Biab because of it's end result but to be able to do it in a more professional modern way. I'm worn out now from all that I have been through and really don't know how much longer I'll be around as things are a bit dire at the moment, so I give as much as I can that may help things go into the future and last long after I'm gone. Peter like me must be getting on now and has come a long way with it, but a big leap now would be great to see for all of us, Biab does deserves being sustained into the future ! Forget AI, use or own God given creativity with these great session players. All I can say is you have great ides and to keep at it and don't let anyone put you off ! I'm sorry if I get stressed out, just been through too much and been through it all too long  God Bless.
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+1
Good effort!
The only thing I would change is get rid of big gradient buttons for cleaner look. Inspector like left panel was suggested before, you done excellent job showing benefits of that.
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That's really nice.
Personally I think I would put all the main views and a Mixer button down the left and move the Side Notes to a view. That way they could possibly dispense with the Views toolbar. I think I'd include Preferences in the Views.
If the Side Notes were a full view, then the Song Form data could possibly also be incorporated on the same view, which feels tidy.
Jazz relative beginner, starting at a much older age than was helpful.
AVL:MXE Linux; Windows 11
BIAB2025 Audiophile, a bunch of other software.
Kawai MP6, Ui24R, Focusrite Saffire Pro40 and Scarletts
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Gordon, I believe the main point robertw wanted to convey is that UI has to be flexible and modular. Under that philosophy, you put your buttons where you want them. If done, and done right, that is the end of discussion on design layout, buttons, positions, colors,fonts, etc.
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I believe we had some consensus on a mixer where the gain bars display vertically. Also some increased detail in the song progress bar. But I would take this for sure.
I do not agree with one point Musocity continues to make, about the ‘old users’ requiring that PG Music maintain the look of the current version. That would be a disaster, to maintain two parallel versions going forward. And it’s totally unnecessary. All users appreciate good design improvements and can learn to adapt to change when the new interface is more intuitive, increases workflow, and can be personalized.
BIAB 2025 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 7 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6, Song Master Pro, Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Roland Integra-7, Presonus 192 & Faderport 8, Royer 121, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors.
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Gordon, I believe the main point robertw wanted to convey is that UI has to be flexible and modular. Under that philosophy, you put your buttons where you want them. If done, and done right, that is the end of discussion on design layout, buttons, positions, colors,fonts, etc. I'm not disagreeing with that, though I would caution about how much adjustment is sensible. It's fine for someone very familiar with a tool, but how, for example, would one guide a newcomer to a particular feature or button when it could be nearly anywhere in a large, complex, configurable interface. Writing a manual would also be challenging. There's much to be said for an interface that doesn't really need much personalised tweaking becasue it's already intuitive enough. For me, the present interface doesn't do that.
Jazz relative beginner, starting at a much older age than was helpful.
AVL:MXE Linux; Windows 11
BIAB2025 Audiophile, a bunch of other software.
Kawai MP6, Ui24R, Focusrite Saffire Pro40 and Scarletts
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The idea here is for users to feel at home with the new interface, that's why why icons have not changed (Many are used to them). The top Icons are static, as well as the side controls (users cannot move them, but can change the icons if they wish). I used buttons because it's easier to know what you have currently selected, than the current icons. ![[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]](https://i.imgur.com/nYh9sk8.png) What is shaded in green are the areas that toolbars can be moved if the user wants, that also includes the transport and radio bar. This way each user sets things up for his own comfort. ![[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]](https://i.imgur.com/Aowbgpp.png) Having the Icons spread out -vs- Clumped together, I feel makes it less intimidating. Over all, anyone coming from the old UI, should very quickly get comfortable with the new one. Robert 
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Is this operational with a future release or is it just a project submitted to the PGM programmers? If it is operational, please provide a link. If it is a project then I am going back to bed, and I will have sweet dreams. 
Biab Audiophile 2025 11.25 Win
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Good question. I assume this is a design prototype. I wonder, since it uses known elements of BIAB that already exist, how difficult it would be to hire someone like Robertw to design the user interface, and link it to existing functions.
BIAB 2025 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 7 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6, Song Master Pro, Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Roland Integra-7, Presonus 192 & Faderport 8, Royer 121, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors.
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Gordon,
"I'm not disagreeing with that, though I would caution about how much adjustment is sensible. It's fine for someone very familiar with a tool, but how, for example, would one guide a newcomer to a particular feature or button when it could be nearly anywhere in a large, complex, configurable interface. Writing a manual would also be challenging."
You can have 2-3 common templates: Easy-Intermediate-Advanced and have them as a default views. You don't want to customize - use given. I am certain most of those who would want to customize, would have certain experience or desire to explore. One of the most cited problems with BIAB is complexity. That is mainly because all the poorly designed menus are "in your face". Good, flexible design will alleviate that.
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It is a design prototype. It uses known elements of BIAB that already exist.
Using known elements to show how ihe UI could be updated and the program still be very familiar.
Robert:)
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BIAB 2025 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 7 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6, Song Master Pro, Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Roland Integra-7, Presonus 192 & Faderport 8, Royer 121, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors.
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Just another thought on this: The CAD I use has many panels for all sorts of tasks and contexts and the way they deal with this is that the panels can be and by default are docked at the sides of the main window, where they can be slide-out on hover/click or can be pinned so they stay out. They can also be 'torn off' and floated anywhere.
I should add, though, that the 'common' setup when using this CAD is three screens, as it's very common to have schematic, layout, 3D and/or datasheets all open at the same time. It's barely even usable on a laptop.
Jazz relative beginner, starting at a much older age than was helpful.
AVL:MXE Linux; Windows 11
BIAB2025 Audiophile, a bunch of other software.
Kawai MP6, Ui24R, Focusrite Saffire Pro40 and Scarletts
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@Robertw
You have hit upon a familiar topic, "GUI redesign", which dovetails with another well stressed topic, "Workflow", which are both aimed at improving the user experience.
More use of Panels has been suggested to PGM for many years. They responded with non-modal (floating dialogs) which is a step in the right direction but no substitute for modern panels with simpler layouts used in modern software. They responded to a large cry for "improving consistency" of selecting tracks and styles by creating a more common look and feel of the "multi-picker library". This was a good step in terms of workflow, but barely scratched the surface of inconsistencies, redundancies and non-modern ways of user experience.
Until PGM realizes that "user experience" will get more customers than expanding the Real Tracks library by 5% or "workflow" will retain more customers than expanding the Styles by 5%, we are stuck with what you see is what you get.
Studio One (latest version), Win 11 23H2 , i9 -10940X 3.3 GHz, 32GB Mem, a 4K 40" monitor, PreSonus Studio Live III Console as interface/controller. secondarily test on Reaper, Cakewalk, and S1 on Surface Pro 3 Win 10 (latest versions).
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... All users appreciate good design improvements and can learn to adapt to change when the new interface is more intuitive, increases workflow, and can be personalized. Absolutely. Look around. By our very nature, we are an adaptive species. +1
BIAB & RB2025 Win.(Audiophile), Sonar Platinum, Cakewalk by Bandlab, Izotope Prod.Bundle, Roland RD-1000, Synthogy Ivory, Kontakt, Focusrite 18i20, KetronSD2, NS40M Monitors, Pioneer Active Monitors, AKG K271 Studio H'phones
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Need to work in parallel with sorting out the workflows and with the graphics design.
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... All users appreciate good design improvements and can learn to adapt to change when the new interface is more intuitive, increases workflow, and can be personalized. Absolutely. Look around. By our very nature, we are an adaptive species. +1 I agree +1
Today I bought a doughnut without the sprinkles. Diets are hard!
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
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Ask sales and support questions about Band-in-a-Box using natural language.
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